Weekend Confirmed 158 - BioShock Infinite, StarCraft II, Dota 2

This is sure to be a nice game and I will surely play it! Bioshock Infinite FTW! I like the plot of the game especially that it is not connected to the previous bioschock games. This will make gamers anticipate the game more.

http://bioshockinfinitecdkeys.blogspot.com/

You say you want the industry to conduct itself in a more professional manner Garnett. Yet, you continually get drunk on air. Throwing stones from a glass house on a soapbox does nothing Garnett. If you want the industry to be respectful, you have to act respectful.

In the section on BioShock infinite, Garnet said something like "we are going to be considerate and steer clear of anything that might be considered a spoiler." I really appreciate that and in general, the show is good when it comes to spoilers.

But then, one of you pretty much said "screw it, I'm going to talk about spoilers anyway." Sorry, I can't remember if it was Brian or Xav. Whoever it was, thanks Garnett for not allowing that. The game was only out for four days at that point. And in my opinion, even if it had been out for a month, it still wouldn't have been cool. I was at least halfway through the game I listened to the podcast. It would have been a shame if I had to abandon the rest of the show because of that.

By the way, it's not an excuse to give a spoiler just because it's something that happens early in the game. Also it's not an excuse just because someone else had revealed it earlier.

Finally, I seen a few other comments talking about doing a "spoilercast." That is an excellent idea. it wouldn't necessarily even need to be a separate podcast. It could tailgate the main show.

Guys, I really like you show and I've been a semi-steady listener ever since you first started, but... and I say this with love... your spoiler-free skills pretty much suck. I gave your Bioshock section about 2 minutes before I had to turn it off for fear of having stuff spoiled (because I've unfortunately been disappointed by spoilers in your show too many times in the past).

That said, I went back and listened to the Bioshock discussion today after I'd finished the game myself. Good discussion, but in retrospect, I'm glad I turned it off when I did.

For reference, your friends over at Gamers With Jobs managed to do a good 35 minute spoiler-free segment on the game this week (and then do a long spoiler section on top of that after the regular show). Don't want to sound too whiny, but if you can't keep it spoiler free like those guys and gals, then please consider keeping your story-driven game discussions to spoiler sections only. Or don't discuss them at all. It's a fine line, I know, but as far as I'm concerned, you keep on crossing it.

Other than that, keep up the good work. :-) (and cool to see Brian back for an episode!)

It's weird to hear talk of a need for innovative games then talk about how metal gear rising is a 39 dollar game. A game that actually brings something different to the action game genre.

DmC and god of war should be 39 as well. Why bother making anything besides RPG's or FPS's if you're considered a b level game if the first play though is under 50 hours. I played fallout 3 and didn't like it. Played about five hours. I don't go out there saying it's a 39 dollar game. Just wasn't for me.

You can't make an absolute rulling on what a game is worth. I didn't hesitate buying MGSRising full price but i decided to pass on Gears Judgement. There's definitely somebody reading this that thinks it's the other way around. I paid 29$ for the second dissidia game, loved it and i put 130 hours into it already. I guess any other game that doesn't match that play time, regardless of the genre, should be 29$.

This price talk needs to stop. It's not like it's set at that price forever. If you don't like the price, wait 2 months, buy it used, rent it. People who love the game come off thinking they didn't pay enough.

Man GameStop is awesome!!!! My ps3 broke down this morning... So I picked up darksiders 2, blops2, all stars, and skyward sword. All not going to play again (all stars is still on my vita via cross buy). Purchased a 320 gig slim for $120 down from the $240 they where asking. All for a few paper weights in my house:)

I have no evidence or reason to assume this, but I'm gonna jump to the conclusion that you guys aren't gonna talk about Toki Tori 2 and complain preemptively about that.

For anyone who's wondering, the game is a delight. Though be aware that they throw you in with no guidance whatsoever. Still not sure why game devs these days think that "not explaining gameplay mechanics" is the same thing as "puzzle design," but it's a relatively small hurtle.

Happy tweeting!

I wanted to touch on the point of all the attention and praise that Elizabeth is getting. Though I found her overall implementation to be great, and the narrative surrounding her to be really engaging, every time she threw me a coin, or pointed out a lock pick or recording, I realized she was essentially Fable 2's dog (not a knock against her, just an observation. Also, Fable 2's dog is pretty awesome, to me at least). And while her tear powers were really cool when it was part of the story, in combat or exploring it might as well been none existent. Crates and cover spawning really didn't impress me, and the limited tears you find while exploring only made it disappointing that there weren't more. 2009's Prince of Persia actually Incorporated their AI princess into the actual gameplay a hell of a lot more than Elizabeth in the end, which is a shame because like you guys pointed out, she seemed to originally have a lot more presence and influence outside the scripted story moments.

In the end these things might not matter, as her main purpose was narrative related; her persistent presence serves to build a bond with the player, and to that end I believe Irrational succeed with impressive results.

Really enjoyed the show. I'd been lagging behind in listening and realized how much I missed listening to you guys!

Battlefield 4 trailer nothing but "shit blowing up"? Might want to watch it again, I just watched it and I beg to differ. They showed a lot of story context, dialog, NPC interaction, etc. It was probably less than 50% action. I don't know what they were expecting to see but an Uncharted 2 style narrative would not fit in a Battlefield game, I thought their approach was great, exactly what I want from a Battlefield game. I though the Bad Company games were good but a bit silly, I like the more realistic style.

This comment spans several episodes....so I apologize if I bring up discussed topics again.

My frist comment stems over the SimCity debacle. As a consumer, I am sympathetic to their plight and the frustration that ensues when you spend money for a game/service and it does not deliver on its promise. I, however, feel that some of the backlash directed to the technology side of the issues is in a state of hyperbole. This is not a comment on the customer service issues that EA has brought upon themselves, but this pervasive idea that since it is now 2013 that all companies should know how to handle internet congestion, server stability, etc... Let's not forget that the area of computer science is a very young field of industry. For all intents and purposes, it has not been around more than 30 years and to think that it is easy to learn from previous mistakes is dismissive. Programming is constantly evolving at dramatic rates and ideas and techniques even two years ago are becoming obsolete.

Second comment is referring to the industry as a whole. It is becoming more apparent with each new story/scandal that this industry is still stuck in the 80s with its attitudes and practices. There is the IGDA incident with scantily clad women at a rave show, there is the missteps of companies and their customer service policies, and lastly the type of games that are being produced. The average of the a video gamer is rising and without looking up exact statistics is in their late 20's early 30's. It is annoying that this industry is still treating its customer base as the 9-13 year olds that we used to be. The audience is growing up and this industry needs to mature and close the gap between what we used to want and what we want now.

I am sorry for this wall of text....

TL;DR
Programming is a relatively very new field...have a little patience when tech doesn't work the first time
The game industry needs to match the average age of its audience....sex and violence isn't as shiny as it used to be.

Sort of spoilage below:
I agree with Jeff in that Infinite falls into the worst and most mocked science fiction cliches. It is basically the Matrix 2 and Mass Effect 3 endings. You are "the one" and there were many "ones" before you as part of an 'infinite' cycle. GiantBomb has mocked this in the past. I'll be interested to see what they have to say in this case.

I also think the way Infinite makes you question its relationship to the first game was essentially already done in MGS2. But to Jeff's point, MGS2 tied its themes. The Patriots turn out to be powerful AIs, and the Colonel and Rose are essentially their proxies. Where as MGS2 had the dangers of digitization in mind, Infinite's racism and religious zeal are just didactic show pieces that reflect Ken Levine's ego.

On Elizabeth, while an impressive piece of tech, she's a pretty weak character. She is basically Belle from Beauty and the Beast, except she would rather folllow Gaton around and do whatever he says than go off on her own adventure. Also she apparently just loves wearing corsets. You know, like all women do. I would say its lame that they fashioned her after a Disney princess, except in this case the Disney princess might be a better roll model for feminism.

That said, I really wished the game had explored the concept of "tears" more. Like that vision of Paris that Elizabeth finds is really the only instance like connecting to the outside of Columbia. It would have been really fun to go racing through flashes of different eras. Or like go to modern day New York but all the people are hairy monkeys, or aliens have enslaved humanity, or something fun like that.

One of the inconsistencies with the ending, is that it almost makes you question whether Booker is in something like the Matrix, or if he's under some kind of hypnosis. Like why does the game grey out in scenes pertaining to Booker's past? Is he remembering something, or has he time traveled back to that era? By leaving that window into Paris as the sole example of anything that's not Columbia, it makes it seem like the whole game is only in Booker's head.

On story telling in games in general, I think there are people in the industry who have big egos, and get propped up for commercial reasons. There's Cliff Bleszinski, Peter Molyneux, and David Cage. They talk a big game, but do they deliver anything dramatically innovative, interesting, or just good? Nope. I'm inclined to think Ken Levine falls more into this category than not.

The thing about Hideo Kojima, is that he put his name on his work and people flocked to him, because it was good. He didn't just do a bunch of interviews for game websites, or talk about being a "power creative" *gags.* Video game fans are hungry for creative visionaries---story tellers who don't compromise on characterization and so forth. But there are very few examples of that kind of thing in action.

Not sure about you guys, but the last time I was kinda emotionally invested in a fps was those Brother in Arms games made by Gearbox. I think they were going in the right direction, but nobody ever brings those up lol

Just a quick comment re: Bioshock Infinite.

I'm enjoying the game so far (only a few hours in) but I have a serious bone to pick with one of the design choices:

I feel the need to constantly search through every trash can and container that I come across is very disruptive to the flow of the game. Traversal takes three times longer than it should because I need to stop and mash the "pick up" button over every single piece of the environment. I can't stand this sort of inventory/loot system in a game of this nature.

Like the first Bioshock, I feel there are pieces of FPS design that are sorely out of place in Infinite.

* I should NEVER need to manually pick up ammo. I should pick it up automatically as I run over it.
* I shouldn't have to worry about accidentally picking up a piece of fruit that will DRAIN my health. The designer's made finding health a tedious chore, so don't punish me for trying to do it quickly.
* For a game that puts so much emphasis on building an engaging and believable world, it is very immersion-breaking for me to walk up to a woman on a park bench, steal everything out of her purse, and receive nothing more than a smile from her.

I LOVE what Infinite is trying to do, I just wish it wasn't bogged down by such clunky, silly, and dated mechanics.

Let me preface this by saying I do enjoy the podcast and love the chemistry that Garnett, Jeff and other (co)hosts have together.

I loved this episode, Bleahy coming back actually brought some great callbacks to older episodes and all was fine until Garnett´s rant about the IDGA party (lucky it was finishing move). It totally spoiled this EP for me.

I don´t mind having a discussion about sexism and gender issues in today´s industry, although to me it feels more of a hipster-kinda thing - I mean, the same exact party happened last year and as far as I know, nobody raised an eyebrow.

So what changed? Oh, I know... 1 reason why. Fair enough, but...

I have a question: Garnett, how different is a party (organised by gaming industry) from a party that goes on in any club around the world? You said you were OK with all the dancers in cages and stuff in a "regular" club, but THIS time you felt offended?

I don´t understand it.

Anyway, I think it is important to talk about these things, make arguments, but don´t go to the extremes, don´t polarise (as much as some people like Ms. Sarkeesian tries) and above all - be reasonable.

Speaking of which, this article on Gamasutra cought my eye and actually reacts to the uproar (and extreme, out of this world hispter/fundamentalist feminism that goes around in the industry at the moment). Everybody should check it out, I guess...

http://gamasutra.com/blogs/JanetteGoering/20130329/189579/1ReasonWhy_We_Need_to_Change_the_Way_We_Fight_Against_Sexism.php?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+GamasutraNews+%28Gamasutra+News%29

When it comes to pro gaming, I just want to chime in my two cents. Can we all just agree that pro gaming commentators should STOP wearing sports coats!!!

I think the game industry is going for a crash.

I agree with Garnett.

Tomb Raider should have sold between 5 and 10 million to be profitable, it won't happen. The game "ONLY" shiffed 3.4 million copies and the sales have been MUCH lower.

Bioshock Infitnite cost 200 millions. That's RIDICULOUS !!! There is NO WAY that game can be profitable.

Does ANYBODY here thinks that the Killzone 4, Infamous 3, Thief 4, Dead Island Riptide, Metro Last Light, Crysis 3 and so so will sell 5 to 10 million copies ? It won't happen...

There only few games that can sell that much, Fifa, Call of Duty, Battlefied, Mario, Pokemon, Assassin's Creed, GTA and no much amny other franchises.

Jade Raymonf is right, there only place for 10 AAA games a year, and even that number is too high.

Let's just look what's coming this year : Mario 3D, Mario Kart, GTA V, Assassin Creed 4, Killzone 4, Battlefield 4, Pokemon X & Y, Wind Waker HD, Saints Row 4, Metro Last Light, Metal Gear ground Zeros, WatchDogs, Rayman Legends, and so many other games. It's not sustainable to have ALL those big games. Some games will fail and we will have disaster a la THQ...

I had a feeling in the back of my head when I saw that MH3U was coming to a home console I would eventually own that thing, and I now do.

So give me your NNiDs and lets hunt some monsters.

One complaint that I've heard an awful lot of is the lack of a 'save anywhere' feature. I personally didn't mind the checkpoint system, since dying didn't mean I had to go back to those checkpoints. I only had to deal with them when I decided to quit playing.

Did anyone else have any real issue with the current save system? I've got a friend who's literally saying that he won't play the game anymore until there's a patch for it, and there's a petition for it on Irrationals forum.

PLEASE DONT READ THIS IF YOU HAVENT FINISHED BIOSHOCK INFINITE


Emotion in games.

BioShock Infinite has for me at least has proven games can have as large an impact as modern story telling in movies. I know we always say this medium is in infancy, and it is. But at least for me I had several moments. Some thrilling. Some sad or even heavily conflicted. They have done an amazing job at crafting this experience to give us a little bit of everything. Below I want to share just one of them. A final one.


****************SPOLIERS******************

I felt that by the middle of this game they really managed to create a non sexual non damsel in distress relationship between the 2 main characters. Something rare in video games for sure. She is a bit of a Disney princess no one can argue that. But this is a different type of prince coming to rescue her. Adventure games such as uncharted thrive on these relationships and are also something often compared as the best "narrative" games we have available. Games like Ico can be pointed at as games that have a unique relationship in them. But something in bio shock really made me feel stronger. They is some magic they pull off that made me what to protect and help Elizabeth no matter what.

After I finished the game I realized how and why they did that. Well actually I'm not sure exactly how that team did that. But they pulled it off masterfully. They made me feel what I needed to without giving me the twist to tell me why I should feel that way. When I did realize why the connection was so strong the emotion hit me like a ton of bricks. When it is discovered what my character had done and why he was chasing Elizabeth I had a moment that I've never had in a game before. I moment I've only experienced in film when considering media.


I recently had my first child last year. A daughter. When the portal is closing and it’s framed so carefully around her face, eyes and hand that is reaching out to me. Booker yells "Give me back my daughter!" In that moment in time I can tell you what Annabelle's/Elizabeth's face looked like. I saw it on the screen. But I wasn’t seeing just that. I was seeing my own daughter’s face being pulled away from me. I cried as the sequence came to a close. I thought how could I?

Now I understand that this moment is probably not as impactful to someone without a daughter or someone who no longer has a baby girl in the household. But it is what it is. It was my moment and I have never felt this way from a game before. I know I would not have felt this way if the game started this way. It was because of the journey that I had with this character. It was important.

**********************************************************************


This game had many amazing moments. But I will never forget how it made me feel. So differently throughout the vastly different parts of its story. Many familiar but some of them hidden, and building towards an impact later. I have never played one that made me feel the way this one did in the final moments.

I thank everyone at the Irrational team that brought this to us. It was worth the wait.

I gotta say i found the whole "tomb raider sold a few million, but is still a failure" a frightening thing to say the least. how is this industry supposed to fair when youve got these idiots in suits thinking that every game is gonna be the next call of duty?! maybe the AAA game industry should fail if thats the case, i mean weve got indie developers more than willing to make games that satisfies their specific audiences, maybe those $60 games that arent worth $60 should die. its like everyone wants to be The Big Thing, the problem being that the big thing already happened when those games (the BIG THINGS) were made.

PLEASE do a Bioshock Infinite spoiler FULL topic on a future show! i want to hear your guys' opinions on the plot points and the ENDING!

Just a side thing, but Leahy was talking about how he couldn't get into Far Cry 3, but I was playing FC3 while listening to the show lol.

I usually try to listen to WC while playing a game or going out somewhere, but I thought that was funny.

FC3 is an amazing game.

Best episode in a long while.
If you had Christian Spicer and made it the regular cast it'd rival the Bombcast.

Also for the first time in a while I couldn't disagree more with Canatta, the gunplay was the worst part of Bioshock Infinite, if the story didn't keep me so invested I may have given up.
The gunplay, mouse feel and UI/control options were awful and kept the game from being near the top of my best games of all time list.
Not to mention stupid design decisions like having Elizabeth teleport around and whenever you get an audiolog and walk anywhere have Booker and Elizabeth talk over it so you end up having to read what was said was annoying to say the least

Lastly the fact you guys play on the PC but use a controller is a total WTF, I've tried the entire generation and just can't play a FPS with a controller, even watching twitch streams is painful, are you guys away from a desk or what? why do you do it?
I've watched Ozzie play the game on stream and it's just hard to watch someone so handicapped

EOTY

Episode Of The Year

The "A" team always comes though. I hope you can manage to get all four of you in the room at the same time again soon Garnett...I loved it. You four balance out each other so well.

Great show, hope next week's has some alcohol involved.

so during the bioshock discussion garnett brought up that while playing, we "were booker". part of why i much prefer the way half life does the relationship with alyx vs elizabeth is in half life, alyx is speaking to me and not gordon. while in infinite elizabeth is talking to booker. and i never felt like i was booker because he had is own thoughts and opinions that i didnt always agree with. he was a character and in half life you are the character. just like in halo i never felt that i was chief, just that i was playing as chief.

Having beaten Bioshock Infinite recently, I can sort of understand what Jeff was talking about, but I think he made the shift in tone sound too dramatic, like it's just thrown at you out of nowhere. From the very beginning of the game, it felt to me like there was more to the story than the politics of the city of Columbia. There are tons and tons of hints to this, even in the very beginning of the game before you even make it to Columbia. So to me, when the story progressed in the way that Jeff ultimately found unsatisfactory, I felt like it was merely delivering on some of the stuff it set up quite a ways earlier into the game, and not making a total left turn out of nowhere.

I'm playing Luigi's Mansion 2 and Tomb Raider at the moment. That's so great to have such amazing games to play. And I have Bioshock Infinite and Crysis 3 waiting on my shevles...

While I can understand Jeff's take on the story "shift" in Infinite, I actually don't think it's really a shift, just a more focused perspective. While I couldn't go in detail without spoiling, what I really think is at the heart of the second half is understanding and uncovering the motivation and desire of the creation of Columbia in the first place, which in turn becomes a far more interesting question and answer.

In the first Bioshock, the ideal of creating Rapture was simply a ideology on the behalf of Ryan, with little else seeming to drive his motivation. With Comstock, the second half of the game gives us a much more detailed, and with the ending, a more complex, personal, and terrifying look at the motivation of the creation of Columbia.

Don't get me wrong, I certainly want to have more time in the political and social firestorm that is Columbia (which I hope the DLC provides) but without the last half of the game being focused on what it is, I don't think the world that Infinite creates would be as strong, as personally investing, and most importantly, as tragic as it ultimately becomes. Rapture was and ideal, but Columbia is a reflection, and there-in, I believe, lies the magic.

I have to say I disagree with Jeff about the Story of Infinite.

What I realized while playing Infinite was, while the original Bioschock is about the city of Rapture, Bioshock Infinite is about Elizabeth. Columbia is merely a backdrop, as apposed to Rapture which was a character in it's self. Yes, Columbia is a very detailed backdrop, but in the end that's all it is. Elizabeth is the main character in Infinite, she is what everything in story revolves around. I'd go into more detail about why this is my take, but that would require spoilers, and I'm not willing to dish those out yet. Maybe next week when more people have finished it. But I would ask Jeff and anyone else willing, to replay the game with having that theory in mind, just to see if that changes anything about your perceptions of the story in the game. Even if it doesn't, I'm just glad that there is a game we can even have these types of discussions about ;)

I don't think Dota to diablo is a fair comparison. A vs game compared to a single or co-op ehhh. Your talking about comparing basketball to 3's company which has longer legs. Well the competitive sport that's always evolving on its own clearly.

You guys make a great point about time and players at tournaments wanting to rushing back. What the NFL does and tournament directors should do is step in. Say no we are going to do replays you wait, don't like it to bad. It's the job of management to control the players for the viewers best interest if they want the leagues to grow. The NFL stops games for sponsors all the time. Football isn't a great TV sport it was MADE a great TV sports by great management.

Am I the only one who finds Elizabeth from Bioshock Infinite really off putting? The way she looks is inconsistent with everyone in the world. To me she's looks like a creepy mannequin/child/Disney princess with breasts. Her features seem so strangely exaggerated that most times when I look at her my immersion in the world is broken. It was bothering me so much I snapped some pics to share.

Here is what women in Columbia look like:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v201/bluemilkman/Women%20of%20Columbia/5FDDD87F-D3C4-4659-B730-727880E01D4C-33244-000024E9C94EAD66.jpg

Here's a standard lass, note the believable body shape and the slight exaggerations of the face.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v201/bluemilkman/Women%20of%20Columbia/88BE136C-5930-4C8D-AB61-8CB6E764D265-33244-000024E9DE5689AD.jpg

Here's a child:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v201/bluemilkman/Women%20of%20Columbia/E6119365-1076-4FC6-BA0A-B5192A9988CC-33244-000024E9EA042D2B.jpg


Now, compare them to Elizabeth:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v201/bluemilkman/Women%20of%20Columbia/FF3568DB-AB76-46AF-B6A2-E96722387986-33244-000024E9F6495612.jpg


She doesn't even look like she's from the same video game.

I personally think the reason behind this is a bit of over enthusiastic design. If you wanna make a girl appear more vulnerable and innocent and in need of protection you make her look younger and more petite/fragile. The massive eyes and tiny nose and large head are all indicators of childhood and naivety. The ridiculously thin waists line, smaller than her head, contributes to her vulnerability inspires a protective instinct. But I think overall her design is a little too exploitative. Not in a sexist or mysoginist way. It's more like they take the subtle design elements designed to make you feel a certain way when you look at a character and instead of applying them in a way that's consistent with the other humans in the game, they cranked the dial to 11.

The result it that Elizabeth looks like a cartoon, she looks utterly comical. I know everyone else in Columbia has a exaggerated style to them but Elizabeth isn't consistent with that, her eyes are bigger than even the children but she's an adult. She has this massive baby face sitting above a pair of breasts. It's confusing and cheap.

Over all I think the story telling and character development in Bioshock is strong enough and Elizabeth's voice actor is right on the mark to the point where they didn't need to make her look like a weird baby faced, child-like blow-up doll to make you feel empathy and love towards her. If she's looked like an actual adult human, like this:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v201/bluemilkman/Women%20of%20Columbia/021222A5-528B-4BC9-91F7-3FDA829DD631-33244-000024EA01795569.jpg

then it would have worked fine, probably even better. Through first class animation, voice acting and AI, the characters in this game are rich, so they don't need cheap design to enhance their personalities.


Am I the only one who is put off by this?

Jeff
JEFF!
GET OUT OF MY HEAD, GET OUT
STOP IT

ugh I wanna thank you for being you man, seriously. I feel more sane that someone out there voiced the same feelings I have about bioshock. FUCK I need to smoke a cigarette

When Jeff started asking for a game where YOU were the smartest guy around, did any of you start thinking "Idiocracy: the game"?

DICE's assertion that the Frostbite 3 engine will allow Battlefield 4 to create new ranges of emotion and storytelling in games might be bullcrap coming from there, but you also have to think about who else is using that engine: BioWare.

Watching the BF4 demo, I kept thinking about what Mass Effect and Dragon Age are going to look like running on that technology. What would holding conversations in those games look like with more realistic facial expressions and animations? BioWare is a much heavier hitter than anyone else at EA when it comes to storytelling, and if anyone can use that engine to make more "human" characters or whatever, it's them.

I think the guys nailed the issue barrier to entry in games like DOTA and StarCraft and how the latter tries to create leagues to rectify it. It's really a problem for almost all online multiplayer games.

Right now most matchmaking is like taking every football player, from people in back yards to the NFL, and putting them on the same field. StarCraft's leagues is a good start, but games still don't really have the equivalent of just regular guys playing in their backyards. There needs to be a sphere where noobs can just have fun.

Most people probably don't want to invest the time needed to become a pro player but still enjoy playing the game and would like some people in the same range of dedication with which to be competitive. The best way right now is to really just play with your friends, but that isn't always easy in an online game.

Arguably a good way might be to have dedicated servers and a server browser where people can form their own little communities (like, for instance, a Shacknews DOTA server). It's a problem that still needs to be solved on way or another though.

So good to have him back. I was just listening to to the very first episodes of WC this past week and was wishing he'd return one day. Prayers answered!!!

Leahyyyyy whatcha sayheeeee on the front paheeeeeeeeeege

I feel like I just stepped through a portal to 2010, in the very best way possible.