Morning Discussion

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  For me personally, I've been having a bit of difficulty lately with TvP, one 1v1 maps when 'toss starts b... : daVinci1980
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    Bunker in the front, get a few SCVs repairing. You can right click it to have them auto repair now. Then... : ZombieAcademy
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      Behind my walloff or in front of my choke? : daVinci1980
      • Behind, so the zealots can't mess them up. Then send them out when you get enough (if you're MMing) : lolpatrol
  • #2101

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    By: cetra00 x Show Full Post

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    Scout early, build Rax early. You should be able to have marines out before they can get a gate up. Kill probe(s) then kill the pylon(s).

    May 21, 2010 9:50am PDT
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    Scout early, build Rax early. You should be able to have marines out before they can get a gate up. Kil... : cetra00
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      I think I scouted it early enough (for protoss on 1v1 maps I scout at 9, at the same time I start my supp... : daVinci1980
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        On a 1vs1 map where you might expect this kind of thing, yeah. I also tend to build my barrack at 6 supp... : cetra00
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          Ohshi, really? I guess I should try that. I almost always do 9 supply, 10 rax. : daVinci1980
          • Yeah I used to do pretty much the same until I started getting owned by 6 pool zerg rushes on 1vs1 maps. ... : cetra00
          • That should be plenty. If you are really worried, just delay your gas and throw up a second rax. pump mar... : StolenNosferatu
          • 6 rax is pretty damn early. I've been doin 9 rax 10 supply on those small maps - often not walling off, s... : Lexicon_Leidun
        • Don't do this. : Blucklesworth
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          Doesn't that completely destroy your econ? : DHAvatar
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            Not really with harvest call down. You can halt marine production and move back to econ as well once you... : cetra00
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              I'm pretty sure getting a rax at 6 fucks up your econ badly, even with the mule. : StolenNosferatu
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                Alright, if you say so. Doesn't seem to be hurting me any, though I'm only in silver league. Mathematic... : cetra00
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                  How do you figure? Everything in this game builds from your opening economy. You're arguing that you ca... : Blucklesworth
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                    Consider the cost of walling in especially if you do get attacked. Repairing costs money as does pulling... : cetra00
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                      I fail to see how 6 raxing stops these costs. : Blucklesworth
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                        Uh...you attack the proxy sitting outside your base before it starts producing units. : cetra00
                        • Who is going to proxy when they scout 6 rax? : Blucklesworth
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                          Yeah but if you open every game assuming he's going to proxy, you're going to be at a disadvantage in the... : sammyl
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                            An all in 6-7 Rax reaper rush build is going to win you a fair amount of games. If they proxy you, you'l... : cetra00
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                              You can see what we're saying right? There's nothing wrong with going all-in every game, but I think it'... : Blucklesworth
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                                Small detail you left out. We're talking 1vs1 small maps where 1) Proxy building is most common and 2) w... : cetra00
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                                  proxy building is not even close to common even on small 1v1 maps. In like 150+ games in silver and below... : derelict515
                                  • in 99% of my gold+ games, i've only seen a proxy twice.. and a 9p scout found it, and i wiped the floor w... : Demius
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                                    Do you play Terran a lot? I see it quite often playing T v P as can be very effective versus the common ... : cetra00
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                                      I don't think zealots would ever break the wall against a competent Terran player. : StolenNosferatu
                                      • See the replay where stolen wiped the floor with me :D : Jimb0v2
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                  I should probably add, people do just fine with it since a 6 rax reaper rush is something I am personally... : cetra00
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                    6 rax reaper rush, when defended,means pretty much you lose against any good protoss player : Demius
                    • Doesn't that entirely depend on whether you were scouted and how much you hurt his econ? If you knock ... : daVinci1980
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                      It depends. If you proxy rush a 6 rax reaper on a small map, it's very, very difficult for Protoss to ha... : cetra00
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                        i've only seen maybe 2 or 3 proxy rushes in the last 40+ games i've played.. you see that stuff a LOT mor... : Demius
                        • Yeah, my standard opening against T now is 9p 12-13 gate, drop the cyb as soon as the rax finishes then p... : sammyl
                • not at our level, but high level play its more of an exponential growth meaning a 6 rax (if played perfec... : Demius
          • You know what completely destroys your econ? Lifting off in Scrap Station to go to the island just above : lolpatrol
        • If a protoss player plays an econ build (9p/ 12 or 13 gate) your'e SO far behind at this point if you 6 r... : Demius
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    Outside your choke or inside your base? If it's outside your choke a simple wall with 1 marine ends the ... : Blucklesworth
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      They're trying to build out of sight, in my natural. : daVinci1980
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        Aren't you walling in TvP regardless? I just can't see how this would be effective unless they are canno... : Blucklesworth
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          I do this - (as the protoss). I've been successful by just having 3 gates set up right outside their sit... : flagg209
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            Maybe I played you, this is almost exactly what happened to me. I think I panic'd, though. :) : daVinci1980
            • You should have 2-3 SCVs just chilling by the wall to repair it. If things get dicey, bring more to help... : Blucklesworth
            • It's possible, but I doubt it, I haven't played 1v1 in some time... : flagg209
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  Anyone else working on their placement matches notice that the new people right now really SUCK? I did a ... : digital_d
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    What seems like common sense to someone who follows the community or has a lot of experience is a complet... : Zek
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      Not to mention that reapers are a completely new type of unit. Even if you casually played SC1, you'd ha... : kek
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        oh god reaper harass made me want to murder people when I started and still does when it hits me just wro... : Juno
        • I love it when people try to reaper harrass me because luckily everyone who has tried it against me has s... : flagg209
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  Are there any units that are designed for "siege" for Protoss? (I realize we have siege tanks as terran : kek
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    Colossi outrange all static defense buildings. : Blucklesworth
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      hm, good to know, thanks. : kek
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        Well, you have to have the thermal lance upgrade, I think, in order to outrange the static defense buildi... : Lexicon_Leidun
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          oh, even better to know. :) : kek
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            Yeah, you should always plan on getting the range upgrade if you're going colossus. It owns. : midgetherder
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              Do you need an observer or something to actually see the photon cannons that you're trying to siege with ... : kek
              • Colossi can see over cliffs, etc. so it's more or less equivalent to having an air unit. So no, they don'... : Lexicon_Leidun
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                I'm fairly certain their sight range is longer than their attack range, even with the extended thermal la... : Blucklesworth
                • okay thanks again. : kek
• I will review this later! : unjustend
• Thanks for this. It should be posted every day. : snot3353
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  Day9's daily #121 (which I'm currently listening to) is about some fundamental basics to learn and engage... : Lexicon_Leidun
  • That was a great episode for a noob like me. : midgetherder
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  is SC2 down for everyone? (are they patching?) : Demius
  • Yeah, down for me :( : sammyl
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  I'd like to bring up that I really enjoy foiling the terran wall in with the zerg nydus worm. What? You... : kek
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    I don't think I have ever won with a nydus worm. Everytime I try it I get raped. I try in just this sit... : SqueegyTBS
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      I'm not a pro but I try to time it for when his army is on the move. As soon as I go Lair I hit the butt... : kek
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        But then I am base racing, and that is always a huge gamble. : SqueegyTBS
        • True, but the difference in this particular case for me was that I had static defense that discouraged hi... : kek
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      This worked against me once (TvZ). I didn't know what the screech was. I found out pretty quickly. Now... : daVinci1980
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        I'm not 100% sure about this but I think the Overlord can be well out of marine firing range to see enoug... : kek
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          But then the marine sees the worm and you have 20 seconds to get ready for it. : SqueegyTBS
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            yeah, definately. when I'm playing terran, I'm always building supply depots on the edges of my base so ... : kek
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              The only problem I see with that is that I use supply busting as a technique for preventing my opponent f... : daVinci1980
              • Yeah, i use to do build depots on edges, but i would lose so many to muta or VR harass. Running a marine ... : StolenNosferatu
              • This tactic works stupidly well against nearly every Protoss player. Fly into their main with about 20 o... : morsxcessum
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      It's good for countering. He moves out -> you worm, kill something, get back in the worm in time to defe... : Blucklesworth
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        pure hilarity can occur from a double worm. I can say I've won a decent number of matches, especially vs ... : NexusOne
        • Can you build 2 worms at the same time? : SqueegyTBS
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          o_O I've never tried that. If you load a bunch of units at the entrance to the worm back at your base an... : kek
          • ^two exits I mean : kek
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            You can build as many exits as you want, and unload units from which ever exit you want. You can have guy... : NexusOne
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              There's a global noise when you create an exit, right? Could you create two exits at the same time, one v... : Zek
              • yea, just like nuke launching, only one sound would play from a double deploy. : NexusOne
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            They come out of the one that you hit "unload all" on. So hitting unload on the nydus in your base will ... : SqueegyTBS
            • Right, but not at once. Are you saying that Unload All keeps track of the units you had in the canal at ... : kek
  • Nydus worms are awesome. I've won quite a few games with them, but they're situational like a lot of str... : DHAvatar
• tag! : Neech