Weekend Confirmed 136 - Medal of Honor: Warfighter, Forza Horizon
by Andrew Yoon, Oct 26, 2012 11:00am PDTHost Garnett Lee is back this week, with some disappointing revelations about Forza Horizon. But before that, Jeff Cannata "turns a corner" on the Wii U, talking up the possibilities of Nintendo TVii. Andrew Yoon rants about Medal of Honor: Warfighter, while special guest Andrea Rene gets passionate in this week's Tailgate.
Weekend Confirmed Ep. 136: 10/26/2012
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Weekend Confirmed comes in four segments to make it easy to listen to in segments or all at once. Here's the timing for this week's episode:
Show Breakdown:
Round 1, Part 1 - 00:00:27 - 00:15:44
Round 1, Part 2 - 00:16:12 - 00:29:53
Whatcha Been Playin Part 1 - 00:30:42 - 01:01:41
Whatcha Been Playin Part 2 - 01:02:47 - 01:31:45
Listener Feedback/Front Page News - 01:32:15 - 02:03:55
Tailgate - 02:04:31 - 02:14:24
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Garnett Lee @GarnettLee
Jeff Cannata @jeffcannata
Andrew Yoon @scxzor
Andrea Rene @AndreaRene
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Original music in the show by Del Rio. Get his latest Album, Club Tipsy on iTunes. Check out more, including the Super Mega Worm mix and other mash-ups on his ReverbNation page or Facebook page, and follow him on twitter @delriomusic.
Heavy Gear Assault continues crowdfunding on Kickstarter
Strike Suit Zero mod tools released
Nintendo kicks off 'Crowdfarter' promo for Game & Wario
Narco Terror announced from Deep Silver
Call of Duty: Ghosts teaser gives tenuous look at next-gen COD
OZombie will be Spicy Horse's take on Oz
Deadpool listed for Wii U on Amazon Canada
CastleStorm assaulting XBLA next week
Leisure Suit Larry HD delayed until late June
Rhode Island looking to sell Amalur intellectual property




Comments
Before I share the straw that broke the camels back I'd like to make a few points. I started listening to 1up Yours and followed Garnett here. Kinnata is great, his rational opinions and thoughts are a pleasure to listen to.
Andrea is the dullest, most terribly informed dimwit who apparently has has no history of game playing and therefore no frame of reference and I have just had enough of her. I don't play many games myself but I don't appear on podcast.
I'm sorry Garnett, I know you get touchy about "your baby" but the fact is your put that baby in a sack, chucked a brick in too then hurled it into a pond.
NOW TO THE POINT..
Your conversation regarding the Eurogamer article. I urge everyone who thinks Andrea has any credibility to read this link which proves Andrea has been taking kickbacks herself:
http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=43764178
She's an absolute joke and terrible hypocrite to boot. It's too late for me, I won't be listening to your podcast again but I'd like to wish Jeff K luck with whatever he does and thank him for the hours of entertainment he gave me. Garnett, thank you too.. I sometimes thought you were a total douche but at least you have a good knowledge of your subject.
I discovered the Bombcast around E3 and it was so refreshing to listen to people discussing games without the constant, inane input from uninformed imbeciles.... I leave you all with this thought:
"but the Wii U doesn't even play CDs"
so long
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Last week I started a conversation that I had not prepared adequately for. I saw an image of Geoff Keighley between a Doritos and Mountain Dew display and thought to myself "well, that's a thing we definitely ought to talk about."
This image, though, was just a provocative header for an editorial about a situation where members of the games media were tweeting in hopes of winning a free PS3. The article then led to a larger discussion on the relationship between videogame PR and the people who cover the industry.
Though I fully expect to get raked mercilessly as is the Internet's way, I'm going to give a segment of the show to the subject this week. And then we're going to lay it to rest for a while.
So, I appreciate that tensions have run high, mean things have been said and feelings bruised.. We're going to set that aside. This thread is the place to add your voice to the discussion. I expect you know but just in case, if you come in hostile and aggressive there's not much chance of being heard. But if you're thoughtful, regardless your point of view, you're going to be part of the discussion.
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I'm still very early into the game (about 2 hours in), and I've already come close to smashing my game disc with the damn statue that came in the Collector's edition and throwing the entire thing out the window.
* Lack of technical polish.
At times, the game looks incredible. But just as often it looks down right ugly. The visual and audio presentation is constantly marred by strange hiccups and annoying performance issues. EVERY SINGLE TIME you talk to an NPC the screen does this annoying "fade to white" effect while it loads the in-engine cutscene. Lots of games do this, but never have I seen it happen so frequently. The early portion of the game involves a lot of "talk to this NPC, walk 15 steps, talk to another NPC, walk back 10 steps, talk to yet another NPC", etc. With the screen bursting to white at the beginning and end of every single exchange, no matter how short.
During these fade-outs, the audio will often do strange things. You'll hear the ambient sound change to a new environment, then change back, all while the visuals are still loading.
The graphics engine itself is also shockingly inconcistent. There is a moment right at the very beginning of the game that features Desmond walking through a tunnel with a little glow-stick hanging from his belt. I was quite surprised to see that the glow stick did not cast any dynamic shadows through the environment. The lighting just looked all wrong. But then the screen fades to white for an 8 second cutscene, fades back, and suddenly the glow stick IS casting dynamic shadows.
The animations have always been one of the most impressive elements of an Assassins Creed game, but in AC3 they have taken a step backwards. Your character seems to bounce his way up walls and ledges as if he ways 10 pounds, completely lacking the sense of weight or momentum that made the climbing animations so impressive in previous AC games.
* Bad design
I was worried that adding gunplay to AC3 was a bad idea, and so far I've been proven VERY right. The guns completely ruin the combat. Firing them is clunky and not remotely intuitive, and reloading takes FOREVER. Historically accurate? Sure. Fun? NOT AT ALL.
The sword combat is great, but the game puts you into situations that force you to use your guns. One early example is a mission that requires you to escort 2 NPCs while protecting them from enemy patrols. All the enemy NPCs are using muskets, which forces you to engage at least some of them from long range. This devolves into firing a shot, then standing still for a full TEN SECONDS while you reload your gun. Then fire again. Repeat. Dullest. Combat. Ever. I'd much rather just scale the building they are firing from and take them out from close range, except that leads to them firing on the useless NPC teammates I'm supposed to protect.
And the climbing mechanics still haven't been improved. Your character will still seem to get stuck on invisible walls, forcing you to stop your movement until the game randomly decides to allow you to keep going. It's been 5 games guys. Fix this.
* Poor choice of setting / time period
I really cannot figure out why Ubisoft thought it would be a good idea to set a game like Assassins Creed in revolutionary Boston. Florence, Vennice, and Rome were beautiful, charasmatic, and mysterious locations. Boston in AC3 is just.... ugly. It is a dirty, muddy, dull location. To their credit, Ubisoft has done an amazing job of making Boston feel like a living, breathing place... it just isn't a place I'd ever want to go. It fails to create any desire for exploration or discovery; something AC2 thrived on.
Ugh. That's enough ranting for now. Anyone else played this game yet? Am I freaking crazy here, and just missing all the good stuff? I really want to love this game, but so far it is just awful.
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http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/halo-4/critic-reviews
:D
Sooooooo stoked. I'm taking off work all next week!
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That was - at best - embarassing...
Seriously ? The voice command for Kinect working properly ? This is misleading to people who have not used Kinect before. Kinect is a good idea. Great concept. But the implementation just don't work !!!
Now, as far the Wii U goes, the features that Jeff is talking about ( off Tv screen, touch screen, mutli without spiting screen ) are working perfectly.
So we're comparing Apple and Oranges here.
Now, it's the right of Andrea to not be interested in the Wii U.
She's right by saying that the vast majority of launch games don't push the gamepad features as Zombi U.
That said, I'm surprised that Andrea can diss a system before even the system is out.
Everybody says that the Vita should be given some time, before being judged, can we - at least - give the same treatement for the Wii U ?
I think that the 360 is quite a different system today than in 2005... Look how the 3DS evolved so much in less than 2 years.
So let the Wii U a chance !!!
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Not only are they making 3 new movies without George directing (thank every deity possible) could this mean we get Battlefront 3?
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Take a shot every time you see the word "nasty" or a variation of it. ;)
http://www.shacknews.com/article/76462/halo-4-review-setting-the-stage-under-new-management
Games like Skyrim and AC3 have a lot of snow and when I can see a way of crossing an icy lake/river a little further away that'll take me 30 seconds to reach, I think "ahh, screw it, you can swim".
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I'm reminded of the 90s, back when the RTS genre was starting to come into it's own, and the old purists insisted that turn-based was the only "true" form of strategy game. Real-time strategy was "dumbing down" the strategy aspect of those games and making them into contests to see who could click the fastest.
Maybe it is a generational thing, but at 29, I'm certainly old enough to remember when lowly consoles games were deemed as twitchy cartoon playthings for small children with short attention spans, and the almighty PC was the home of the thinking man's games. Even at the time, the argument seemed disingenuous to me. It would be no different than if I were to claim that PC games are for chin stroking intellectual wannabes and console games are for people with actual gaming skills. To be clear, I don't believe that for even a moment, but you get the idea.
It's not about the input method itself or which one is better, it's about the attitude implicit in digging one's heels in the sand over one side or another. To play whatever feels most comfortable is always the best choice. Calling controllers on the PC an "abomination," however, betrays an unflattering perception of what console gaming is actually about.
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BUT....
The Kinect is a total pain in the ass once you find the content you were looking for.
For example:
I sat down with my wife to watch the latest episode of Forward Unto Dawn. I used voice commands to pull of Waypoint, and jumped in. Great.
But while we were watching the episode, the fucking Kinect kept thinking we were trying to wave at it every time we shifted positions slightly. The stupid cartoon "waving hand" kept poping up on screen. It was annoying as hell, so I walked over to my Xbox and unplugged the Kinect.
Big mistake. It booted us out of the video player. I had to plug the Kinect back in, restart Waypoint, watch the 30 second add before the show AGAIN, then find our previous spot in the video. We just had to put up with the "waving hand".
NOT a smooth experience, Microsoft :-/
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I'm not saying it's an excellent or even great game. I'm saying that there actually was a really good game buried in there somewhere. I think calling it "unplayable" reeks of massive hyperbole.
Let's get things straight - the story was as nonsensical as RE ever is, the franchise has dropped all pretense of survival horror, the vehicle sequences are utterly unnecessary, and the constant QTEs and scripted events are pretty terrible. There is a lot wrong with RE6, but there were times when I actually enjoyed the core gameplay loop a lot.
The problem is that RE6 does a horrible job of teaching people how to actually play it, because when played right it's nothing like Gears or really any other third person shooter. It controls like those games (with a frankly impressive amount of tweaking options) but the way you're supposed to do things is different.
The game does almost nothing to tell players about the dodging abilities, the weapons that affect each enemy the most, how to set up enemies for melee kill-shots, or really any of the special moves you can do that become important to surviving the game. I didn't even discover most of the coolest gameplay elements to RE6 until Jake's 3rd chapter - after I'd played all of Leon and Chris.
Jake's first two chapters were crap, but the game clicked for me the first time I tossed out a flash grenade to daze some enemies, equipped my remote mines, dashed and slid past said enemies, and planted the mine at their feet mid-slide.
In an interview one of the main designers from Capcom even noted how a full tutorial was the one major thing he didn't get the chance to put into the game.
If this is what next gen looked like I'd be satisfied.
There was a great Nintendo Direct with plenty of games annoucement for the Eshop.
Why this is not covered ?
That was great to hear impression form Jeff C last week on Paper Mario by the way.
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Hey, Capcom. Call me. We can fix Resident Evil. Together. :-)
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD CAPCOM, DO IT!!!
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Any impressions?
Personally I'm loving it to bits. I've played a lot of excellent games this year, borderlands 2, Sleeping Dogs, but as soon as I started playing AC3 it's clear this game is in its own league, it's super confident and if it was any more polished it would be a trip hazard.
Full disclosure disclaimer: I was in fact paid a large sum of tommohawks by Ubisoft before posting this.
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The editorial subsequently caused even greater fallout as events unfolded over its core content about the participation by media members in a twitter contest to give away a PS3.
That wasn't what we talked about, and I'm reluctant to get back into the subject this week though we can.
But to those interested, if you have not already, read Robert Florence's follow up http://botherer.org/2012/10/26/guest-post-robert-florence-on-the-last-few-days/ on how things spiraled.
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It's like saying people only want to read fluff entertainment pieces instead of hard news. It just simply isn't true. There are people who want to know how the industry works, especially those who want to work in it.
Saying that no one wanted an investigation into the 38 Studios debacle, for example, just isn't correct.
I'm disappointed that you guys (and pretty much every journalist in the industry this week) all immediately brush off any notion that people that write about games are too cozy with PR people as "bullcocky" or "conspiracy theory". As soon as it's mentioned, you circle the wagons and form a defense line. A lot of people see a problem with *that*, and rightly so I think.
As for "I wish people cared this much about shit that really mattered".
I think people's perception of how you do your job *does* matter. If you *appear* to be bought off, whether you are or not, how is that going to affect your career and reputation?
To be fair, Jeff C has a point about being more concerned about things like the election.
Garnett has a point that Jeff K is more of a presenter now, which is true, but the site *currently* issues reviews. If Gametrailers was simply trailers and Jeff's video pieces, I don't think people would make *as* big a deal, although I think people would still question how the game is covered on their site.
Andrea - Personal relationships with PR is the norm in a lot of industries. Getting free swag and free games is not.
I cannot seriously believe Garnett is trying to compare advance press coverage with getting free PS3s. If you're not I'm sorry, but that's the way it came across.
Garnett - I guarantee that no one thinks it's suspicious if someone goes to E3, tries a demo and gives it a favourable impression. However, if you go on a trip paid for by the company and then write a favourable impression, that's going to make people sit back and think "Hmmmm".....
It's all about how it's presented. Come on, I would think that's obvious to everyone.
As for what people want, they want coverage that comes across as objective, and I think that applies to people who read all kinds of journalism - except Fox News watchers maybe.
I will say that I actually think WC/Shack has solved part of the problem by having sponsors that are only peripherally related, which helps a lot.
Most people were mostly making fun of Jeff K for what happened. What happened right after that (and what you didn't talk about) is what people are upset about.
Robert Florence wrote a piece on Eurogamer including the name of one person, Lauren Wainwright. . That person's parent company *allegedly* threatened to sue Eurogamer, because of the libel laws in the UK. Eurogamer then turned around and edited the article and removed the "offending" part of the article. Now Florence is out of a job, but it's not been specified whether he left or was fired.
Wainwright tweeted a promo thingie for a chance at a free PS3, the tweet was something enthusing Tomb Raider. Turns out she's a freelancer for Square Enix, so there's a definite conflict of interest. Now it looks like she used her parent company to force Florence to retract his pointing out her conflict of interest and got him fired.
THIS is why people are so furious, because this is a prime example of what you guys are talking about. There's no opinion here and no trust based on her actions, because whether she is or not, now she looks like a shill for Squeenix.
This was the important part of the story and you guys didn't even touch on it. Totillo is on Neogaf right now saying "it's a non-story".
Once again, the wagons are circled, the defenses are raised. "Nope, there's no problem in games writing" (since you don't want to call it journalism).
This is important because people in all walks of life should be accountable for how they do their job and games writers seem to think they are above it. I can't say I'm particularly surprised that you guys didn't cover the important part of this story, but I am damn disappointed in you for not doing it. This is the kind of games journalism I think that people would like to see.
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You say you stand by your opinions, but let's clarify something.
This discussion did not arise because we are "jealous" of Geoff Keighley.
To infer that suggests you have a gross misunderstanding of the listening audience of this podcast.
Considering some of your past opinions on certain topics in gaming, such as on-disc DLC and Bethesda releasing faulty games for the PS3, your track record would suggest that misunderstanding is deliberate. Also, it indicates you don't hold a very high opinion of gamers.
You owe the listeners an apology.
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The only reason they would make deletion obtuse is to get people to upgrade the HDD. Which is a weird motivation considering PS3 doesnt use a proprietary HDD so they're not even doing it right.
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Let me just say that I agree with a lot of people that there's a lot of worrysome behaviour in games journalism and I agree with what the Eurogamer article says about the worries of games journalism and the need for more separation between PR and journalsim.
But why is that pic so horribly offensive? What is he doing in that photo? Am I missing some context? He looks kinda uncomfortable sitting there. He looks like he might have been causally snapped while sitting for a second. Or was he promoting the products? I don't know. Until I know the context of that photo I can't think anything good or bad about Geoff Keighly, he's just ... sitting there, unaware, being a conduit of huge controversy.
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To the Mouse and Keyboard point, I think it is a generational thing. At 35 y/o, I still love my Mouse and keyboard over a controller any day. BF3? Fantastic with a mouse and keyboard, couldn't stand playing that with a controller. Put any fast paced shooter on there for that matter, CoD, TF2, L4D, even those of us who play Quake Live (Yes G, Quake is still alive!).
I think there are still a ton of mouse and keyboard players out there, but have gotten older and quit the internet arguments that have gone on for the last decade and a half. Not to mention, I believe most PC Gamers play on consoles too, not looking at it as a this vs. that kinda thing like it was in years past.
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Cheers!
I mentioned this in the thread last week, but I've released it now so here is a link:
Transformers: Fall of Cybertron Multiplayer Guide
http://cruellegaceyproductions.com/transformers-fall-of-cybertron-multiplayer-guide/
I'd love to know what you all think!
That's the key word-- profession. Journalists are professionals, not merely in the sense that they do journalism for a living, but also that they have formed a broad community or culture that shares a set of ethical standards for conduct within the profession. Of course, there are exceptions and people on the fringe in any profession-- doctors, lawyers, plumbers, and yes, journalists-- but in general a profession has an agreed on set of standards and it polices itself.
Mainstream journalists-- those who work in newspapers, television, radio, and increasing online-- are not only concerned about conflicts of interest. They are also concerned about the *appearance* of a conflict of interest.
I could write on at great length about how mainstream journalists avoid such conflicts (or sometimes fail to do so), but let me simply emphasize the most important point: video games journalism, or whatever you want to call it, is a young profession. So young, in fact, that one may not be able to truly call it that, at least not yet. As a practice, it has not been institutionalized-- games journalists have not come together to create any sort of organization that can codify ethical behavior, at least not successfully. That would be a good first step.
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But anybody who has ever used games as an outlet for ANYTHING should watch this short film about a girl who uses Zelda to cope with some difficult stuff.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=4B9ytjJKJPE
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With the addition of IE the only thing Bing search is missing is access to my dvr.
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PS3, 360 no WiiU advertised on the PR
Big Deal or Not?
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The WiiU feels like a something for everyone device and that mindset which should prove useful for their pocketbooks doesn't inspire hope from me as a consumer.
My biggest fear is how this approach will affect the other 2 console designers in the next gen and that worries me, it is already creeping in with SmartGlass which looks to just be an Artbook only digitized and displayed while you play, which I don't want to view while I play.
Also how much do you guys wanna bet they aren't selling the controller in NA at launch is partly because they are going to do a WiiPad XL with Multi-Touch at sometime in the future.
(I do really want to play Monster Hunter though, fucking Capcom and their being a traitor to the PS2 then the PSP)
I work for a car manufacturer and of course newly released cars are sent to the biggest magazines and websites so as to get coverage of it out there. Similar to video game sites, over the long run no magazine could possibly afford to buy all the cars they want to test. And of course there is already much contact at trade shows etc so that people know what to expect in the coming months/years.
And when buying a car the risk, effort and involvement is even much higher than with video games so you really want to be able to rely on an outlet's verdict. That's why in both industries their integrity is so holy to them. If word gets out that product reviews are colored/tainted that particular outlet will go down very quickly.
That leads me to the question: Did GameSpot take any actions after the episode with the soon-to-be GiantBomb guys? Was the manager that asked for a better review fired? How did they handle that in order not to harm their reputation in the long run?
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Her favorite character? And why?
Favorite stage? And why?
Favorite item? And why?
And her most epic defeat? Those ones always stick more, but of course epic win?
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my thoughts are this, look at the world as everyone is a human, some of us are rich, some poor, some fat some thin, some smart some not. some people in "game journo" get to play games, and GET PUT ON A PEDESTAL just because he or she gets to talk about games that other people listen to. this fact alone makes it possible for anyone trying to sell or get a game recognized use that persons pedestal to try and get the game "out there".
so yes while i respect people in "games journalism" i also know that if i suddenly put them on a pedestal about how "oh they know games the best and i must listen to what they say almost as verdict" then i have become the problem, not that they may have used a hashtag for a game or anything because of a PR person who got to them. i will go look at the game MYSELF and use the thoughts and words of the person i respect as a guidline to MY OWN THOUGHTS.
the problem with the world today is things are SO EASY for people to not think for themselves or form opinion that may be different then those they see as a hero or on a pedestal of respect like muscisians, politicians, tv/movie stars, radio DJ's, that what happens is they dont even try. how many times do you ask someone a question because thats easier then googling it for yourself and owuld take the same amount of time to finsd out. it's just where most of society has gotten, this is why it only takes one person to tweet or say something that is a blantant lie, to go viral and become the "truth" because of societal concerns.
so the message is, think for yourself, study things, it wont waste your life to take the time to form your own opinions based on knowledge, not what you have "heard/read". look at how much meta critic is used for bonuses and probably purchases by people, because most people just use review scores to tell them what they like, because its easier and has worked for them in the past.
WAKE UP PEOPLE!
/end rant
sorry if this made no sense or is gramaticaly bad or has bad spelling, it was more of a stream of conscious type of rant. thanks for having a website and podcast that allows this kind of rant/thought, and thankyou for talking about it.
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