Weekend Confirmed 130 - Wii U, Mark of the Ninja, Borderlands 2

Wii U is for families.

I am grabbing one for the kids and wife and I. SMB Wii U and Nintendoland are perfect for us.

I also find the Wii U the perfect complement to pcgaming. EAsy to get into, pick up and play, family can all have fun, local multiplayer, etc gaming.

As a gamer I love the fact the Wii U is going to focus on new ways to play. That is what gaming is about. I like new experiences.

And for a family I am looking forward to the continuing the game on the controller feature when someone is gaming and someone else wants to watch tv.

Not sure why the launch lineup isn't any good. SMB Wii U and NintendoLand as party games. Maybe Zombie U if it pans out. Might even pick up a BO2 if it reviews well. 2 screen local multiplayer would be perfect for my oldest son and I.

I thought Weekend Confirmed came across as superficial in their criticism of the Wii U. Oh SMB looks the same. Oh that tablet controller. Oh the graphics are the same. Oh no one is going to buy a console when they can games for the 360. I do get it. YOu guys don't have families. YOu play games 24/7. IT's not cool to like Nintendo. etc. But it would have been if your criticisms were better thought out.

Random observation on Borderlands 2: there are no black people. Uh for an expansive, planet spanning, RPG with customizable characters, and little actual narrative pull, the game is bizarrely Caucasian oriented. Are black people not allowed on planet Pandora? I know there was some controversy about "girlfriend mode," but I suppose being patronized is better than complete omission.

I love everyone on the show but could you guys please stop shilling these games? The past two weeks you guys have run hour long infomercials on Borderlands 2! I come here for critical and cutting discussions on games you love and hate. Listening to Andrea/Anthony talk about the awesome elemental exploding barrels is just not good radio. I will figure out those finer details of the game when I play it, please don't waste my time discussing something that really has no value out of the context of the game.

I find it funny that no one is mentioning that Ass's Creed 3 is on the Wii U as a launch title and might actually look better than the PS360 versions

Did anyone ever play Joy Ride Turbo on 360? Not the first Kinect game, but the XBLA sequel?

I downloaded it the other day because by best friend was over and she complains that she's always left out when my other mates and I play the Xbox (she's only had a go at Lips and Rock Band). Having downloaded the trial, we jumped in and played together, and within minutes we were hooked. I bought the game for 800MSP then and there and next thing you know it's 5 hours later and we're zipping around the Stunt Parks searching for Car Parts to unlock new vehicles. It's a really fun kart racer-like with great vehicles, a really cool visual style and some really challenging AI. A definite surprise, considering the first game copped a lot of flak :)

I know that the first part of this message doesn't technically relate to this week's episode, but I figure it will be seen here (as opposed to the thread from two weeks ago).

First of all, I'd like to thank everyone who was kind about my appearance on WC for the episode of 31/8/12. I had a fantastic time, and the SN community was incredibly welcoming. I'd like to thank Garnett Lee and Del Rio for taking the chance and inviting me on; Jeff Cannata for challenging my challenges and genuinely being as kind as he comes across in all his online videos; Jeff Mattas for being just as well-considered, wry and funny as I'd hoped; Ryan Calavano for calming me during the pre-show and QOTW segment; and, as I mentioned on the show, Christian Spicer for being an amazing friend and helping me out with absolutely everything while I was in LA.

I'd also like to respond to the neogaf comments. I don't have an account there, so here will have to suffice - you guys, too, were surprisingly wonderful and kind about my appearance. To those that say I didn't speak enough: I was actually super self-conscious about speaking too much! Considering I'd had a 30+ hour day the day before with only 5 hours sleep, I actually hope I got a decent balance of saying enough to sound like maybe I knew what I was talking about, without saying too much and having you all realise what an imposter and a phoney I am!

So yeah, there's that. Thanks to everyone for the twitter messages, the facebook subscriptions, the messages left on my blog, the lot. I didn't expect it, and it was incredibly nice.


REGARDING THIS WEEK'S EPISODE:

I understand why there was such an outcry re: the crew's opinions of the Wii U. Does that mean I think that most of the hate-filled, vitriolic comments are justified? Good god no.

I believe the reason it came across as such a downer cast is because the entire three-person crew was largely ambivalent (or, at least, stated ambivalent/negative viewpoints). When people agree with each other about something, that opinion becomes intensified in the mind of the listener, and you begin to hear things that aren't /actually/ being said. I genuinely do think that Garnett is one of the best - if not the best - podcast chairs out there. The *problem* (such as it was) that Andrea René and Jeff Mattas both seemingly hold similar viewpoints -- they want to see potential, but atm can't quite see it. If there had just been one extra chair who had a lot of love for the Wii U, I feel like a lot of these baseless comments wouldn't have been posted.

I also feel like there's a problem in the comments re: Garnett's suggestion of the system being expensive. I'm sorry guys, but it is. It genuinely, actually is. The Wii sold like gangbusters because you could get TEH BEST VERSION11!!!! for $250. Yes, I don't entirely agree with Garnett's SKUs fragmenting the market idea, but that's not to say it doesn't hold some truth. The best Wii = $250, the best Wii U = $350. If you're not a gamer, that's a weird thing to come to terms with.

Personally, I really really really do think it all comes down to marketing at this point. The Wii U has the potential - in my opinion - to sell as well as the Wii did, if they aren't stupid about their marketing. The Anthropologist in me (that's why I mentioned 'the exotic other' in episode 128 btw, if anyone picked that up) can easily see different ways of marketing to different societies in order to maximise sales. They've got it covered in Japan - you don't need much more than "HEY THIS HAS MONSTER HUNTER". Now let's see how they cover the West..

The Last Story > Xenoblade

Someone's gotta say it, might as well be me.

Well, after having listened to the episode, I don't see what all the fuss was about.

Jeff was probably the only negative-nelly, seemingly to be overly critical about the WiiU a bit more than warranted.

I felt Garnett was fair, echoing most of my disappointments and coming to the WiiU's defense a bunch of times. And that's the key word, disappointments. With the exception of the criticism of a lack of a DVD player I felt most of the issues the crew had with the WiiU aren't based on being a fanboy of Sony or Ms and bashing on Nintendo, but rather the criticism comes from people who expect so much from Nintendo and long for them to make a triumphant return and recapture the core of what made them great.

At one stage we were all in love with Nintendo, but the direction they've taken hasn't lined up with where us hardcores have gone. The idea of a Wii HD, a core machine, is thrilling. We get out hopes up. But aside from the second screen (which is a fantastic idea) to me it feels like catch up. They're moving into online gaming, HD, current gen graphics...

The bottom line is, nothing blows me away. Nothing. The graphics aren't blowing me away, the second screen hasn't blown me away (sure it's got potential but I'm excited by reality, not promises). The ports of games somehow look worse. How can you expect anyone to be thrilled or enthusiastic about the WiiU? It's not showing us anything exciting or thrilling. When I first saw Mario World and Mario Kart, the graphics, the Mode 7, my jaw hit the floor. When I first saw Mario 64 my jaw hit the floor. When I first saw SSBM my jaw hit the floor. Each time I said to myself "I gotta have this, NOW!"

I see the WiiU and there's none of that. Just a second screen.

The day might come when the WiiU shows me something that makes me freak the hell out and pull out my wallet. But I don't see it now. And clearly I'm not alone.

I'm in two minds about the complaints about the Wii-U.
I don't think the price point is as bad as the next Xbox/Playstation are going to be but I don't think it's a big deal there's no Wii controllers in the box. Most people will have one - and a balance board for the Wii-U Fit.
I understand some of the complaints about the launch line-up (IE Monster Hunter vs. Nintendo Land) but I do think games like Ass's Creed 3 will help it because it's launching at the same time as the other two versions.
We will (at some point) get separate game pads to buy - but they are retardedly expensive.
I don't blame you for being a bit negative, but I don't think it's quite as doom and gloom as you predict.

That being said, I'm definitely waiting a couple of years. There's bound to be an inevitable Nintendo revision in the future.

I'm always amazed how Nintendo fans come out spewing fire when anyone makes a negative comment about any of their hardware. Say in any gaming forum that the Wii was a bad system or that you regretted or glad that you didn't buy one and you get Nintendo fans coming out of the wood work defending it. Well I'll say this for myself personally and then make some points about the Wii U. I loved Nintendo when I was younger. I played a lot of great games on the SNES, N64, and Gamecube. That doesn't change the fact that the Wii, regardless of it's success, was not a good system software and hardware wise when compared to the other systems. Put it this way, for all the supposed great games that came out on Wii think of all the great games that didn't come out on that system. Anyway I have some major concerns about the Wii-U

1. HDD Space. You can't claim to be supporting digital purchases and give the system such pathetic HDD space. In a phone 8GB is too little, let alone in a HD console which has to render HD art assets.

2. The controller. All I have to say is this, we certainly saw how devs used a unique controller to bring brand new and amazing gaming experiences to Wii owners last gen. People never said that Wii games were at their best when they used the motion the least. Certainly those same devs will bring their great talent and imagination to the tablet controller... (Side note, why would I want to look away from my awesome TV to a... blown up DS screen?)

3. Dev resources. Best case scenario, sales wise, for the Wii-U it sells as well as the Wii. It captures the imagination of the public and it sells like hotcakes. You know what though, even with that optimistic view point, it will still run into a similar problem that the Wii did. The most talented 3rd party devs will not develop for it. The games will be ported more easily now since the controller has the same inputs as what is considered to be the standard controller but those devs will be devoting their time primarily to the offerings from Sony and Microsoft. Devs want power. They want room to try new things on screen, they don't want to be hampered by under powered hardware. Why do you think they've been bitching for the last couple of years for Sony and Microsoft to release new systems?

4. PS3 and 360. this has to be said again. Devs have made it clear that the Wii-U, at best, is a slightly more powerful version of what has been available for 7 years. At best you get a slightly better looking version of a game that you can get on the other two consoles. True you can't get HD Nintendo games on the other two consoles but judging from last generation it's not like Nintendo releases their games with a lot of frequency.

I've been skimming the comments (holy crap this was a divisive episode!) and I feel like I need to point something out. I don't think the next Xbox and PS4 are going to be any more powerful than what we see in top end PC games today.

Let's look at this realistically. We know that the next Xbox will have Kinect 2.0 included. We also know that Sony has been losing money for years now. Kinect 2.0 is going to add considerable cost to the next Xbox (as much as a fancy gamepad with touchscreen I'd guess). Microsoft can't have a super powerful console AND Kinect unless they want to charge you $499 or more. So something has to give. It'll be the RAM and CPU/GPU that take the hit. Sony on the other hand will try to make a profit on the PS4 from day one. Why do I say this? Because they did it with the Vita. ( http://www.industrygamers.com/news/playstation-vita-3g-actually-profitable-for-sony/ ) They' can't afford to take a loss of hardware. They've been losing money for years now. Just the Playstation division alone lost 45 million for the quarter ending in June. The company as a whole has lost a total of 11 billion dollars over the past 4 years. I've included links to show just how bad Sony's financial situation. (They'd have to sell off 80 percent of the company to pay off their liabilities.) The point is they CAN'T sell at a loss. This means you're not going to get another PS3 type powerhouse.

So, anyway, I think people need to remember these things and adjust their expectations of just what we're going to get in the next generation. And when you look at it from this point of view the Wii U, while still the weakest, isn't going to be that much less powerful.


Sony financial links:
http://www.notenoughshaders.com/2012/09/08/the-ten-year-decline-of-sony/
http://www.gamespot.com/news/sonys-game-division-loses-45-million-6389811

Hey Garnet and Crew, I too was getting ticked off at all the negativity towards Nintendo but I see that the Shackers have already put you guys through the ringer:-).

OK...you guys are not Nintendo's target audience. The Wii U message "Great for families and just core enough" probably doesn't resonate very well with most Shackers. But look at the big picture...Nintendo is going against giants like Sony and Microsoft. They would love love love to give you a console that can be next gen with ridiculous processing power...but the truth is they will probably be banking their company on it and then Sony and Microsoft will outspend them easily and succeed. There is no room at the top for 3 console makers who will make relatively the same console. Sony and Microsoft can probably survive taking bites out of each other in that market but not Nintendo. They tried competing head to head with the Gamecube and you saw what happened.

So Nintendo can only do what they can do...they need to find that niche just like they did with the Wii...something that is innovative which is not based on how much advanced hardware you can pack into the console. Will this happen with the Wii U? I don't know but I really hope so. I use my PS3 more then my Wii but my most favorite gaming memories these past 2 years has been playing Kirby's Yarn, Mario Galaxy, Donkey Kong Country with my daughter.

So cut Nintendo a break guys, you can be critical but at least give a little more viewpoints then just that the Wii U sucks. Bring Billy in or something.

Garnett "$300 is expensive", "gaming PC's aren't that expensive, yeah about $500-$800 more then a console."

Lmao it's like I'm listening to fox news;)

Great show again. Minor nitpick, about 50 minutes in, someone is sketching or scratching out a lot on a notepad. Headphones easily picked it up.

I think the WiiU is too expensive for the tech. Similar tech (minus the controller, which I'm not sold on) costs less. No pack in game for the base. The pack in that comes with the $350 package isn't worth writing home about, and there's going to be $50 to $100 in additional controllers (Wii Remote+, game pad, etc..).

I really like that you opened up the Wii U coverage by bashing on the 2 skus and sarcastically saying, "because that worked super awesome for, you know, anybody else." Um...I'm pretty sure this has worked for FUCKING EVERY COMPANY. Please, tell me of ANY piece of tech that doesn't have different options for customers now days.

1. the WiiU not having a dvd or blu ray player is not a big deal. i have 3 dvd playing machines hooked up to my tv and anyone who has a ps3 or 360 probably has a couple. Nintendo Tvii is a much better feature than a blu ray or dvd player.

2. Nintendo Land has numerous single player attractions.

3. Nintendo has stated they will use exact pricing on their eshop just like they do now, no virtual currency.

4. Having a call of duty game where i can play splitscreenless couch multiplayer, i will be buying it on wiiU and so are my buddies.

5. the 3DS offers online gameswhere you can join and talk to strangers, i think the WiiU will as well.

6. you have to pause the game to do the stuff that the gamepad offers, i think its a better option than pausing and quicker.

i seriously think the opinions on wiiU here are just plain ignorant.

I have very little interest in Xbox 720 or PS4, and that's thanks to Steam Big Picture mode. It's like I just got a console for my computer room. Those boop, boop water droplets when it starts up give me the warm fuzzies. I love it.

The biggest advantage I've found from having this mode is it allows me to focus. Usually when I have Steam open, I'll get distracted by either my web browser, or just going through my games trying to figure out what I really want to play. Big Picture directs me to my games; it gives me a short list of games I'm currently playing, and lets me avoid feeling guilty that I'm not playing Magicka or The Undergarden or whatever else is sitting down at the bottom of my list. That list is still there, it's just not guilt tripping me when I just want to relax.

I just finished Assassin's Creed 2. Been playing it off and on for .. a long time. Big Picture just sort of forced me to go ahead and finish it. (Also, Garnett, I really wish you'd had that conversation about AC2.. it really is an interesting one, having now played both it and the original AC.)

Now I'm probably not your average gamer. I still have an SDTV in the living room, our only television, which the wife and kids monopolize on the weekends and evenings, so having a 'console' in the computer room that the kids can't take over is a wonderful oasis for me. Not having to buy a whole new crop of games is also wonderful. (I have a large backlog of games on Steam that I'm hoping this will force me to get to.) But really, this is the best thing that could've happened for me. I can kick back in my comfy chair in the computer room, fire up Big Picture mode, and play some games with the controller. I can get my console experience now without disturbing my wife, or having the kids climbing all over me. And guess what, it was free.

There are problems; not every game has controller support, and of those that do, some of them have launchers you have to navigate with a mouse before you can get into game (hi Ubisoft). But I'm hoping more developers start to keep Big Picture mode in mind whenever they develop their PC games. I recommend people here give it a chance, if you have a 360 controller and a few games that support it. It's a really nice experience.

Aside from the gloomy Wii U talk, I almost forgot about Garnett's comments on the Tokyo Game Show (which starts this coming week). Sadly, I can't help but agree with him. I think it's indicative of the excitement waning from Japan's output in the industry, at least compared to what we see at E3, PAX, and Gamescom.

More and more of the stuff shown at TGS over the last few years had had less and less pertinence to gamers outside of Japan. Less and less of it is for consoles, and every year more of it seems to concern games that are still a long way away from overseas release dates, if they even get released outside of Japan. Nothing really electrifying has come from TGS in a while, but we'll see...

So my question for the Weekend Confirmed crew. If you were suggesting a console to buy this year, and someone said I have $300 to spend on one which one would you suggest?

360 4 gig with Kinect

360 250 gig

PS3 250 gig

WiiU 8 gig

I ask this with the knowledge that getting the 360/PS3 you get this large back catalog, and have about a year before support drops off. One you get motion, the other you get the full harddrive space.

And with the WiiU you get current titles and those going forward, but also whatever comes out for the next 5 years.

Great episode guys!

Re: Wii U

I'm the very first person to call Nintendo out on their poor dicision making when it comes to their hardware, but I do feel Nintendo has a particular advantage with parents that you might have overlooked.

Andrea made a great point regarding the importance of auxiliary features (ie Blu Ray player, Kinect, etc) when it comes to selling a console to parents.

However, I think the demographic of "parents" is changing drastically right now. In previous hardware generations, the average parent was not a gamer themselves. But we're now getting to the point where many parents grew up playing Nintendo games.

I don't have kids yet, but when I do have children my first choice of hardware for them would be a Nintendo platform, because I have such fond memories of playing Nintendo games as a child. The idea of sitting down and playing Mario, Zelda, or Pikmin with my kids is enough to sell me on a console right there.

Still, for right now, I personally come down on the same side as Jeff Mattas: Nintendo simply isn't making a console for me, and that's fine.

First, some precisions :

- the Gamepad cost 107 $ in Japan, but the Yen is so high. So when the Gamepad will come over it will be more 90 $ or something.

- "on par" : If it's "on par" because the devs refused to invest more money to make the games look better. And I don't blame them as the console as no install base yet. But that doesn't mean that the console is "on par"with the 360/PS3. The Wii U is more powerful, better GPU and more memory than any of the current gen systems.


Mario Galaxy 3 ?
I would love to guys !
But you are aware that New Super Mario Bros on Wii and DS are among the best selling games of ALL TIME ! They both sold more than 25 million EACH. That's more than GTA IV total sales .
So New Super Mario Bros U was the best choice for a launch title and the game looks phenomenal.
And please All Gears looks the same ! All Uncharted look the same ! And I don't see you complain there !

The Price ?
The Price is SPOT ON !
For God sake, it's barely more than a Vita that doesn't have ANY storage.
Kinect and the 4gb 360 was 300 $ and it did well. Here we have a new console at the same price and it should tank ? COME ON !

More storage ?
Get a SD card ! Or an external HDD !


So here is my take on the Wii U...

Nintendo made sure to secure many of the games coming on the other platforms, to make sure that gamez - like me - can enjoy thos 360/PS3 games on a Nintendo platfom. This holiday, Assassin's Creed 3 and Black Ops 2 on Wii U for me ! I'll buy as well Tekken, Ninja Gaiden 3 and Arkham City that I skipped on 360 just to play on Wii U.

BAYENOTTA 2 ! Congrats Nintendo, THIS is a sign that they are really serious about core gaming on Wii U.

Nintendo brings this holiday great exclusive games like Rayman Legends ( I'm surprised Jeff that you're not excited by such a title ), Lego Undercover, Zombi U, Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate HD ( for Japan ) and Super Mario U. Besides plenty of games will have exclusive content like Darksiders 2 or Tekken. So the line up is fine.

Do you think Nintendo can fail with a Mario game at launch ??? COME ON !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The 3DS did not have Mario at launch. Have you seen what 3D Land and Mario Kart did for the 3DS ?

Nintendo is doing the thing right here. They didn't even show ANY big title like Mario 3D, Smash, Donkey Kong, Metroid and so on. They keep those titles for the PS4/720 days. When the PS4 will launch in Japan at the same time as Smash or Mario Kart... Good luck for them !


PS : Garnett preorder for the Premium are running out at Gamestop. Make up your mind fast :)

I consider myself a hardcore gamer, the Wii U will eventually be bought at my place, even as a college student. my girlfriend/room-mates love getting drunk and playing the wii. the only thing is we won't be buying it until a sale comes on or theres a price drop.

my PS3 is the media centre under the TV, bluray/dvd and we connect a hard-drive as well.

Does anyone know if Nintendo is mentioning the proprietary drive system in the marketing? Or have people accepted that Nintendo devices habitually don't run other physical media of the time.

A lot of the discussion in here makes me think Wii U may have a chance. At first I didn't give it much of a chance, but I'm more willing to see how it plays out.

First, I don't look at the Wii as a "gamer" console. When we bought ours, I was 38, with two 8 yr olds and a 5 yr old. Within a year, every family like ours had one and even a majority of the couples without kids we knew had one. We pretty much all bought one for the gimmick of the motion control. Everyone played bowling at someone's house, where you acted like you were 'throwing' the ball and it was so much fun as a party game they bought one too for Wii Sports. A few folks I knew bought Guitar Hero (another gimmick game) and that was about it. The point in all of that is everyone I knew who owned one, couldn't tell you who made a XBOX or PS3 and they didn't play games on the PC. They were basically non-gamers and after the gimmick wore off, the Wii started collecting dust. My guess is the Wii craze at that time was made up of a lot of families and couples like the ones I knew. We bought a lot of kids titles, but I stuck with gaming on the PC. My first thought was that Wii U would not get 90% of them to upgrade and buy a Wii U and I don't see the game pad catching fire as the gimmick that sells Wii U. But, we'll see on that one, maybe I'm wrong and this will be the next great gimmick every kid has to have and it will be a huge hit. Like I said, 90% of the families and couples I know who had a Wii will not buy a WiiU, but that doesn't mean there are not a billion other people/families out there who are looking to buy their first console, like we did 4 years ago.

Nintendo is very good at marketing to families and kids and, in my opinion, that is better for their bottom line than pushing the fact that you can play COD now on a Nintendo product. In fact, you wouldn't believe some of the comments I got from some of the other parents we know, who owned a Wii, when we said we were buying an XBOX. The fact that they know nothing more than what they see as they cruise the game isle with their kids at Wal Mart and compare game titles and box covers between Wii and XBOX/PS3 means nothing to them, they've got their opinion as to how violent and bloody the games are for one group and 'family friendly' they are for the other.

Add the 'hardcore' market who buy everything and the Nintendo fans and this thing has the possibility to be big. Only time will tell and to dismiss it simply because if does nothing more than today's XBOX/PS3 leaves out a lot of other factors leading to it's success or failure.

Just the rambling of a 42-yr old ex-gamer with 3 kids, full time job and not enough time to play in peace anymore.

The WiiU terrifies me, disconnected segmented screens turn me off gaming immediately. I will clarify, video games are inherently abstract things, I press a button and an action happens I understand that and it is the nature of controller based interaction regardless of the controller.

I get immersed in games when the controls are simple enough to learn so that I can stop looking at my hands entirely and using my eyes and my mind I can make the game move without thinking about where my hands are. Having a screen smack in the middle of that controller and continually looking at it breaks my immersion with the screen in-front of me. I LOVE HUDs (Metroid Prime doesn't work without all those icons on the main screen). I love well designed menus and I think giving me the ability to consistently look at that stuff breaks game flow and is less immerse than pause menus or not pause-able menus.

Nintendo has moved and created anathema to how I want to play games and that troubles me so much.

Ok, to make it so I am not attacking anyone I am going to give some thoughts on the WiiU first and Nintendo Second.

Wii U - the year old port comment is a little unfair. Yes Mass Effect 3 and Batman are coming out, but so are Assassin’s Creed 3, and COD, the two largest releases of this year along side their other platform contemporaries. Darksiders 2, Tekken and Madden coming out a few months after their other console counterparts. Add to that some exclusives like Rayman and you get a decent smattering of games. Better third party representation than Nintendo has had in years. Problem is those games are available on other platforms and I will dig deeper into that in the Nintendo Section.
As time goes on Pikmin, Wonderful 101, Bayonetta 2 etc. will flesh out the library and new announcements from Nintendo 3rd party will come.

As for the confusion about the off screen play, I expect to use that feature all the time. I expect that when my wife and I are having the last few hours of down time at the end of the day we will flick on the TV and I will play multiplayer off just the pad. Chat with her about current events or the show on in the BG between spawns, I don't play that seriously. I may be unique in that I see the features like off TV play as more central than playing with both screens. I have precious little spare time, I often have to choose between TV time with the Mrs. and game time, if this means I don't have to short change my wife as much and I get more game time I win.

I also like party games so the asymmetric stuff sounds fun. My friends and I play local multi a lot so the ability to play full blown COD co-op off one system appeals. Again the factors of my life and taste are different than that of the people on this show, but that is why I am posting, not to debate you, but to offer a different point of view.

Finally I think getting COD etc. on Wii U is less about people with 360s and more for people like my older Brother. He wants to get into games, but his wife says she will end up widowed, so if he could go off TV when she wants to be around, but not actively engaged with him he can get in some play time.
On Nintendo and 3rd parties - I think they may have painted themselves into a corner here. Most "Hardcore Gamers", for lack of a better term, buy all consoles, they purchase the Nintendo console, because there will inevitably be that Mario Galaxy level experience they don't want to miss out on. Unfortunately that means they don't play much else on the system and resent the full purchase cost of the hardware.

My new theory becomes that whether that "Hardcore Gamer" realizes it or not what they want is a Playstation or/and Xbox with a variety of first and third party content, along with a Nintendo platform with just as much content as each of those systems without any title overlap. Its increasingly frustrating for Nintendo seeing as how Sony and MS are not held to the same standard and their libraries overlap big time without causing a stir, meanwhile Nintendo has to have a library just as large with entirely exclusive high quality content. This would either be achieved by Nintendo being able to produce way more first party than possible or by having third parties making AAA tent pole releases just for Nintendo at the same time as making entirely different AAA tent poles for the other two platforms. In both scenarios the resources just don't exist.

Maybe that will be why Nintendo eventually falls off, the also ran place they put themselves in means that course correcting does not work because it just gives them the same titles as are available on other platforms and that's not what this community wants, but its the best I think they can offer.

Love and Peace.

I'm sorry, but did ANYONE see that Rayman Legends rhythm platforming video?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5QoFmYaQaQ

In a just world this would turn out to be one of the Wii U's system-sellers.

Here are the launch titles for Day 1

- Rayman Legends
- Call of Duty: Black Ops 2
- Assassin’s Creed III
- ZombiU
- Mass Effect 3: Special Edition
- Batman: Arkham City Armored Edition
- TEKKEN TAG TOURNAMENT 2
- Scribblenauts Unlimited
- Epic Mickey 2: The Power of Two
- Rabbids Land
- Just Dance 4
- Marvel Avengers: Battle for Earth
- Sonic & All-Stars Racing Transformed
- MADDEN NFL 13
- NBA 2K13
- TRANSFORMERS PRIME
- Your Shape Fitness Evolved 2013
- Game Party Champions
- ESPN Sports Connection
- Darksiders II
- Nintendo Land
- New Super Mario Bros. U

Pretty impressive !

Andrea, you wanted suggestions for buying a PC about a year ago. I don't remember you bring it you again. Is playing PC games not in your career path?

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As far as Nintendo winning back the hardcore, I don't think they necessarily need to "out-CoD" the competitions, but if they can find and fill a niche, something that appeals to a hardcore crowd but doesn't necessarily need the highest of the high end hardware to run, then they've at least got a foot in the door.

For instance, and I admit that this is anecdotal, but upon hearing the announcement for SMT IV, I've read several comments to the effect of "well that settles it, I'm getting a 3DS." Atlus' support for that system has been fantastic, and considering how quickly they got on board, I'd like to hope that it's worked out well for them.

The Wii was in a tough spot when it came to finding a niche because there was only so much you could do with the remote, but the game pad, whatever else you might have to say about it, at east does have enough control features that even if not all of them are supported all the time, at least it won't constrain game design.

Maybe the WiiU becomes the go-to place for Bullet Hell shooters? Menu heavy JRPGs? Turn based strategy games? Retro-styled indie games? Minecraft clones? Roguelikes? A pinball game with a table creator/editor?

A man can dream, can't he?

Can we please stop acting like it's a foregone conclusion that everyone's Wii/3DS/Vita/PSP/Whatever is off in a corner collecting dust?

Sure, if you're splitting your time between 3 consoles, a PC, 2 handhelds and 2 smartphone platforms, yeah, not everything is going to get the attention it deserves. People like me don't have that kind of time or monetary budget, we can't buy hardware we're not prepared to commit to.

As it stands, I've gotten hundreds of hours of enjoyment out of my 3DS thus far, playing an even combination of first and third party games in a diverse range of genres. I've been burned on a couple titles, (the Sims3 for 3DS is a really, really shoddy port with most of the content stripped out) but I'd say at a ratio that's about on par with the PC and 360.

I love Nintendo games so in turn i like having my Mario, Zelda and Metroid playing box, but i have zero interest in Wii U at this moment until better games are announced. Also you guys were talking about Nintendo not having a dvd or blu ray in the Wii U and being mad. I agree that it was stupid the Wii did not have a dvd player but now on the Wii U it's not a big deal. The Wii U will have Netflix and i think Hulu on it and I just realized you guys didn't bring up that point.

Nintendo showing off the Wii U two years ago at E3 was a complete disappointment and so was this years E3 and now that its two months away i'm still disappointed. When next years E3 rolls around and Microsoft and Sony show what they've been cooking up I believe both of them will blow us away with their new consoles.....unlike Nintendo

There we're explosive elemental barrels in the first Borderlands, so thats not some amazing new feature Andrea and if it was a new feature to Borderlands 2 it would still not be very exciting......come on no one remembered those barrels, get wit it.

Garnett,

You were righ about the Gamepad price 170 $ ( which is 107 £ )

Sorry.

Source : https://www.google.ie/search?hl=en&newwindow=1&site=&source=hp&q=107+%24+gamepad&oq=107+%24+gamepad&gs_l=hp.3..0i5i30j0i8i30.2932.16164.0.16783.19.16.3.0.0.0.52.604.16.16.0.les%3B..0.0...1c.1.JN3JsW_WV5Y

I have a few friends over at Klei, really happy to see their passion and hard-work break through in a game where all the ideas and mechanics lined up. Hope the upward trajectory continues.

I want to make a disclaimer! There was MUCH I left out of my "Borderlands 2" impressions. I know I called the game "perfect," but let's face it, I was only at Level 11 haha. There are other issues I would love to discuss at a later time, maybe my next appearance including: boss fight structure, inventory management, and difficulty scaling.

That's all! Thanks :)