Evening Reading
News:
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- ArmA 2 demo released
- Battlefield Heroes quietly launches
- id's John Carmack talks future plans
- War Hero confirmed as future Gearbox project
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Ajax
replyOfficial Michael Jackson Remembrance Thread
Post your well-wishes and/or ytmnd's here.-
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creepy isn't morally or legally wrong. It's definitely uncomfortable, but that doesn't make it wrong.
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it's definitely creepy, but with all the law enforcement on him for it there was never proof he did something illegal, and the people who accused him were suspiciously suing rather looking for criminal charges.
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This is how I always viewed it. I think he was a pretty disturbed guy due to being raised by Joe Jackson (which, to be honest, would probably scar anyone) and was trying to have a childhood that he couldn't have the first time.
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You know, I kind of buy into the whole, "Kid at heart thing." I mean, the fucker was crazy, there is no doubt. I don't think he fucked a kid in the ass or anything. His behavior was still wildly inappropriate and I think his money made it go on longer than it ever should have.
I certainly can appreciate his impact on the music industry and enjoy the songs when they happen to be playing on the radio or in a video game (Vice City), but I am not a die-hard Michael Jackson fan.
His life was a public spectacle and so is his death.
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I liked him a lot, I credit my first nightmare to him (watched Thriller when I was 3, bad idea). I developed a super-high fever due to meningitis and I saw dozens of Michael Jackson heads floating around my bed. It was fucked up.
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I hope people remember him for his awesome music instead of those stupid bullshit lawsuits.
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People often say, "We don't know for sure," when the question of Michael Jackson molesting kids comes up. But they are sure as fuck convinced that the families who sued him were doing it for the money, or even wanted their kids to be molested to receive a cash settlement. Why don't I ever see people say, "We don't know for sure," when it comes to those families?
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I don't know, he was a pretty easy target. I honestly never got the "child molester" vibe from him, he had a lot of problems but I don't think he was a sexual predator.
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So the verdict of the jury (privy to much more information than any of us) doesn't mean anything?
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Nope, but you're basing your opinion off of even less information than the jury.
I dunno, I was thinking about this type of thing the other day. As soon as you're accused of something (doesn't matter what it is, or if there's any evidence available), most people will automatically assume you're guilty. It's pretty fucked up, and it's not an easy habit to break (I know I certainly have a hard time with it).-
But I'm still saying, "We don't know for sure." All we have to go on is what we were presented in the media. Gun to my head, no, I don't think he intentionally hurt any kids. But I still think that kind of behavior is wildly inappropriate and in the long run does more harm than good.
I wonder if he was ever in therapy to deal with these things. I think the people around him never said no to him and never gave him the tough love he needed later in life. I mean, gosh, look what he did to his face. It's a joke but also sad at the same time.
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What behavior? He was never convicted of doing anything wrong. You're speculating.
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I will.
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My menengitis fever only caused me to see shadows turn into dancing Renaissance men. I am jealous.
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i have this pretty sweet remix of that track good loungyt house
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On one hand I miss the old MJ of old, on the other hand in the past 15 years he led a pretty despicable and horrid lifestyle and I'm not sorry to see that go. Sorry, but everyone knows he did molest those kids, and it's pretty fucking irreproachable. Oh and doesn't help he looks like Skeletor.
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So some white trash hooker-mom accuses him of molesting her kid and you assume it's true?
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Well, he was a weirdo. But being a weirdo doesn't mean you're a child molester.
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I don't agree. He had a Peter Pan complex, was tragically naive and was the weirdo King-of-the-Freaks, which made him an easy target for money grabs. Afterall, who are you going to believe the innocent kid or the super freak?
I never heard of any definitive proof, so I'm not going to judge him for that. There is no way to know either way, but both cases are tragic.-
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Ill remember him as the King of Fuking Pop!
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Yea, because you never know. The jury has more information than anyone else to base their judgment on.
Who am I to decide someone is guilty of a crime just because it seems like something that they might do? -
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You forget he paid them 20 million dollars to make the story go away. You don't do that unless you have something to hide.
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That was the 1993 allegations, not the 2004 allegations. The fact that he paid off the 1993 family caused California to pass a law against that.
I can't find it anywhere but I could have sworn the deal was that the 1993 family father was in a business deal with MJ that MJ pulled out of and so it seemed to many that he was accusing MJ to ruin his career and get the money in a settlement.
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You're claiming absolute knowledge of something that's impossible for you to verify. That's a logical fallacy. Don't do it.
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lol...thanks professor woombate for pointing that out. There's few things that are impossible to verify but that doesn't mean you can't take an opinion on whether it did or did not happen. I can't verify that OJ was a murderer or that Scientologists are in fact wrong about everything but that damn sure doesn't mean I can't believe the opposite.
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That used to be pretty common.
I had to cut many a switch and give it to my mom for my own switching. The unspoken rules were I had to pick a good one (long and limber), remove the leaves and then hand it to her. As soon as she had it I could run. She'd chase me a ways, and I'd usually only get it on the back and on my legs.
I still have a small scar on chest where she got lucky one time, cracked that switch like a bull whip and ripped a small chunk out. I show it to her every now and then with a "see what you did to me!" comment, but to this day she just laughs and says "you deserved it". I expect that she is right. :)-
lol jesus christ! My dad was that way when i was little, but he rarely disciplined me. My mom on the other hand, she beat my ass all the time.
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you know I hope if he molested some kids they speak out more openly now and can set the record straight. the big problem is the shadiness always involved people suing him, which is equally shady. we really need some more proof one way or another.
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hasnt been posted here yet so: http://files.kruzen.com/072003/michaeljackson.jpg
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He may have gotten all weird later in life but you gotta admit the man was a hell of an entertainer back in the day. It's funny cause I was watching a bit of that Jackson mini-series last weekend on VH1 I think and it was bringing back all these memories. He was one of the first artists I listened to when I got old enough to be aware of music. When his Bad album came out my parents took me to see his concert. Man that had to be back around third or fourth grade. Such an amazing yet tragic life.
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...wow, that sucks. Off The Wall and Thriller are two of the best pop albums ever.
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I'm wondering if he's going to be cryogenically preserved. I vaguely remember hearing something about this.
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Question
Do you guys think we'll ever see another musician reach the level that he did when it comes to body of work, fame, and global image?-
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whenever I hear this name I still think of the Duchess of York first
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For music artists? Nothing immediately comes to mind. Maybe Madonna.
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Probably not, but it isn't impossible. I think a modern day equivalent is Justin Timberlake. Both had good producers, both came from boy bands and were the standout talent in that boyband, both were good dancers (though MJ shits all over JT imo) and both had supremely catchy pop beats that were miles beyond their competitors. I think the only difference now is that we are saturated in that hip-hop-R'n'B-infused pop world now and that it's hard to be as breakaway and revolutionary.
Something JT lacks in his music/videos/personality is that sense of creativity and I guess, to a certain extent, insanity that MJ had that really propelled him into superstardom.-
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It really depends where he goes from Futuresex/Lovesound which gave him ridiculously broad appeal but lost some of the pure pop sensibility of Justified (which, to be fair, was a far weaker album). If he could drop some of the synthy hiphop grunge and step back into the classic pop now, I think he'd be dynamite.
Also, his work with lonely island proves that he's got good range so he really should try something a bit lighter and, dare I say it, "wackier".
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I think JT stands out. He has evolved pretty well since the kids on the block days. I think he has the potential to be as big as MJ. Just if he starts, does he then turn himself black?
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no
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I don't think so. The internet has made it so easy to specialise in what music you listen to. Before music was rammed down your throat on TV and Radio. You didn't have a choice in what you listened to except if you went out and bought albums your self. Now everyone can listen to who ever they want when ever they want.
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It's weird that MTV is playing music videos but completely unsurprising that the videos are only 30 second clips of MJ's 20-minute, $8MM videos... all in-between 10 minutes of Sway and whatever celeb friend they can get on the horn or in the studio to remind us for the 50th time in a hour that MJ is the King of Pop.
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I liked all the (good) random-assed shit he did
- He was an unlockable character in Ready 2 Rumble Boxing: Round 2
- He was a character in Space Channel 5
- He played himself in obese crazy white man form in The Simpsons
- He did a Super Bowl halftime show to a dead silent indifferent crowd of Packers fans
- He made a cameo appearance in Men In Black 2
- He did the background vocals on Rockwell's "Somebody's Watching Me", the one and only hit that guy had
- He did a duet with Eddie Murphy on one of Eddie Murphy's attempts at a singing career-
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When I heard about him dieing, this really old Techno song came to mind - http://shadowdane.shackspace.com/Michael%20Jackson%20Is%20In%20Heaven%20Now.mp3
Of course minus the part about him going to Heaven. LOL
No idea where this song is from, had it on my hard drive for YEARS. -
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how did your mom actually die, if you don't mind sharing...
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i'm not sure if i ever talked about it after that in any depth. i didn't read that because i still can't actually talk about my mom without crying. (i can type about it though, so most of my conversations about it have to happen in IM. fucked up, but that's life.)
and it is not conclusive, what happened.
i was trying to type up all that lead up to her death but it would take a longer post, and i'm not sure anyone is interested enough for me to go into it, but the long story horrendously shortened is her bowel weakened, perforated, and because of other instances and my mother's high tolerance for pain, no one told her to go to the doctor and while most would think she would have gone to a hospital and had this figured out days before it killed her, she didn't, until she collapsed and her heart stopped.
which is why, when i read that article about jackson, i thought that something like that happened to him. whether it came on quickly or was a slow burn like my mother, it sounds like he collapsed from something, his heart stopped, they resuscitated him but, like my mother, blood had not flowed to his brain for a long enough period of time that while he was "alive" at the hospital, he was never going to come back.
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Maxwell Payneson?
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It's crazy... Just last weekend I said to my friends "if there's one thing I regret about my music collection, it's that I don't have enough 80's MJ on it" and they all made fun of me. One of them was one of the first to say "omg I can't believe MJ is dead"
I still can't believe it. How sudden and unexpected. -
Man watching some of these videos their showing, Michael Jackson up to about Dangerous was a bad motherfucker.
What do you guys think will be his SONG, the one that 100 years from now people will still remember. It's gotta be Thriller, that song is fucking bad ass, and the video is one of the greats if not THE great.-
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That's up there too.
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Billie Jean by a mile. Thriller was awesome cause of the music video - but musically I never vibed it.
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^^ but Smooth Criminal and Jam have always been my favorite tracks from him.
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Billie Jean. Thriller was an awesome video/song, but Billie Jean holds up better over time.
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the bassline to billie jean is so fucking smooth, and when the synth kicks in, it just blows up
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I just watched that on Youtube and it's awesome, but I'm also 99% certain that he lip-synced the the whole thing.
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Jackotards are the biggest, and most illiterate idiots in the world and further erode my faith in humanity, how can we hope to drag ourselves out of the mire our civilization is in with so many intellectually challenged people around? You can read some of their amusing drivel on the TMZ site. I suppose there must be something wrong with a person prepared to listen to any of his musical output over the past 20 years - shrieking mediocre electro-pop with self-glorifying, pretentious lyrics complete with vomit-inducing videos depicting the hero saving the world/all the children or at least their bottoms.
The comparisons that some of them have made between Jacko and Jesus are fantastically blasphemous and I'm an atheist. If he was such a paragon of virtue, then why was his home and garden PACKED with statues and pictures of little white boys in various states of undress? Go check the online catalog of the Neverland auction. The much exaggerated claims about his charitable activities are mostly concerned with his "Heal The World" (fucks sake) organization, which seems mainly to have been designed to funnel children to the theme park at his home, making them useful pawns in his promotional campaigns for his appalling music (and potential dates of course). Outlandish claims about his humanitarian efforts are hard to verify independently, suspiciously the same figures are quoted ad naseum by his worshippers.
The next few weeks are going to be excruciating with the media's habit of turning dead celebs into gods.-
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50 of these statues around the world would disagree:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b8/Michael_Jackson_sculpture.jpg
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The first Michael Jackson song I heard was WAY back in 1972. It was "Rockin' Robin", with the Jackson 5 when they were in their prime. Over the years, I remained a fan, but my favorite album by him was Off the Wall. I liked Thriller well enough, but it wasn't my favorite. I think I wore my album of The Wall out. Quincy Jones was involved in that one and it had terrific songs, infectious beat, and one of the slickest productions I have ever heard, before or since.
After the Bad CD came out, I kind of lost interest. Then there was the weirdness, like hanging out with Emmanuel Lewis or MacCauley Culkin. Mr. Bubbles his chimp. Sleeping in an oxygen chamber. Then all the accusations about his personal life. I just kind of got fed up with him. Yes, he was a gifted performer, but his personal life overshadowed everything and I just couldn't take him seriously as a musician anymore.
I will say though, he did a concert in the early 90's that was broadcast on HBO that was probably the best performance I have ever seen. It was amazing.
Sad to see him go. Making a guess here, but I imagine it was a combination of anorexia and prescription drugs that did him in. Anorexia is tough on the heart and the drugs would have been the kicker. The fact that his doctor was with him when he collapsed kind of makes me suspicious.
Anyway, the King of Pop is dead. Long Live the King. -
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Contribution: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7MmEMrCRfc
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I am truly bummed out. DIdn't think it would bother me so much until I got home and turned on MTV. I think everyone around my age range grew up and at one point or another idolized Jackson in some way. I was in a class when we found out and some young girl (In her early 20's) basically said so what. I grew up listening to the Jackson 5. I don't think some people understand how this guy was probably at one point the most popular person the planet.
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yeah. i grew up pretending to dance like him as a kid, i'm sure my parents have video of this somewhere. he was totally my favorite, and anyone who grew up in the 80s probably sees him as a music and entertainment icon.
he had a fucked up childhood and an abusive dad, i feel bad that he ended up so crazy.
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Love you Jackson Baby!
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According to reports, he died from a heart attack when he saw himself in the mirror for the first time.
In all seriousness, I enjoyed his musical work in the early days, but hated all the media crap later in his life. It got to the point that no matter where you turned, there was something going on about him, and it was getting to be rather tiresome.
However, most of the blame for all his issues has to lie with his father. He really fucked his kids up. :( -
Nobody can listen to ABC, just like 123 and not dance. Same with Billie Jean.
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I can.
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Colleton broke them.
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nobody can dance like that hot chick in clerks 2 to that song.
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My favorite song and video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex30DYwQlHU
Nobody did videos like he did. -
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This was an underrated classic from when the Jackson 5 became The Jacksons. Great song.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xW1fXL3s7bk -
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Annoy some guy named biskits.
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Make him rise from the dead and make a thrilling comeback tour in which he eats the brains of his fans and fuck little boys.
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Since 2003 alone
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_Ones_(Michael_Jackson_album)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Jackson:_The_Ultimate_Collection
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Essential_Michael_Jackson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_of_Pop_(album)
To say nothing of
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greatest_Hits:_HIStory,_Vol._1
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i still don't think he ever touched those children
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from Wikipedia:
"In 2001, Poundstone was arrested on a felony warrant for three counts of committing a lewd act on an unidentified girl under the age of 14. The Los Angeles County District Attorney's Office also stated that Poundstone was charged with endangering two other unidentified girls and two boys.[7] Few details were released, but the prosecutor indicated that the charges were a result of an incident in which Poundstone was driving her children while intoxicated. She accepted a plea agreement and pleaded "no contest" to felony child endangerment and a misdemeanor charge of inflicting injury on a child. In exchange, the three charges of lewd conduct were dropped by prosecutors.[8]
Poundstone was sentenced to five years probation and 180 days in an alcohol rehabilitation program. Following completion of the program, she was granted full custody of her adopted children but permanently lost custody of two other children who were in Poundstone's home as part of the foster care system.[9][10]"
Were there other charges that she was cleared of?-
I don't know. I have her book (on tape, which she reads) wherein she flat out says she was guilty of child endangerment by driving drunk with them in the car (and refers to herself as a criminal), but of the child molestation charges all she says was that the charges were dropped.
She also said that she had a court order against her getting in touch with her inner child.
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What year was that?
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JT doesn't sing live, does he?
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absolutely he does, his live performances are pretty sick
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rzOkaIRqwk
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Well if you remember what happened was
- Every year the halftime show is something that the football crowd would care about or at least find entertaining
- One year MTV puts on a 20-minute concert during the halftime show, complete with a countdown timer to when the game comes back on
- That year the ratings for the halftime show go to shit and MTV's go way up during the halftime show
- Super Bowl organizers then decide to cater to the MTV demographic to keep people from tuning out. MJ's performance was either the first or second one they did
- Now the Super Bowl halftime show features some musical act every year because fuck the crowd in the stadium, the TV viewers are more important
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An absolutely amazing artist. His influence was felt over every music genre for decades in terms of sound, production, presentation, music videos, concerts and promotions. He was a musical genius that brought some of the best of Motown to define what I really enjoy in 80s pop. He was never afraid to bring awareness through lyrics and I always respected that. I was really looking forward to his upcoming concerts in England.
He was a strange man as well, but I just could never listen to him speak and hear any malice.
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To be fair to GW, those slaves came with the house he bought.
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Even the Catholic church. And if they do it, then how could it be wrong?
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best of motown? Insult to Marvin Gaye, Smoky Robinson, etc.
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He also passed a 4 hour health exam to be insured before his new tour was to start.
:S
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Anyone else love the Moonwalker arcade game? I played the hell outta that thing.
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Like in other examples, I separate the "work" from the "personal" aspect, and at this time I choose to remember the "work". His influence is undeniable and he produced one of the greatest albums ever. I'm sorry for those too young to really ever see the impact he had in the industry at his peak. RIP.
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RIP Vincent Price.
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Man this shit is so out of the blue, I just found out and it's fucking crazy. I mean, he's been crazy for years now but it's still really weird and out of the blue. It's always weird when celebrities die, but Michael was up there as one of the most famous, ever.
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waiting for the L4D Zombie Thriller Tribute
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I never understood what anyone liked about him. Anyone who owes $400 million and is renting out a house for $100k/month is either brilliant or a retard.
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Yes I know some people liked his music. I never understood why because it is shit. Dude trying to force his voice into a falsetto and reclaim what he did at 8 years old is embarrassing. At 8 though the kid rocked.
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I think the only thing most people liked about him was his music. He was clearly pretty fucked up otherwise.
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...Well, it looks like his death is really highlighting the rampant idiocy of everyone with an internet connection. Here's hoping you all die in prolonged and painful battles with cancer in your genitals.
And no, I'm not just talking about the ones bashing MJ.-
we love you too.
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I heard it was from food poisoning, 'cause when he died, he had 12 year old nuts in his mouth.
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We should remember Michael by watching these legendary flash videos.
http://www.hcn.zaq.ne.jp/cabic508/rsf/mff.html -
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Pretty much.
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For those who weren't around earlier to see him at or near the height of his fame, is to think of it this way-
Whatever we know about MJ being hated or ridiculed in the last 10-15 years- take all that negative attention, reverse and multiply it by 1000%- that is how much the world loved Michael Jackson at one point in time. Watching him perform was akin to a family event at times. He brought people together. And I am not a huge Michael Jackson fan day to day, but I need not qualify these remarks. Simply just understand that as big of a joke as MJ became, before that, he was basically the hottest shit on the planet for an extended period of time and adored by millions. People react to that, you feel like you lost someone who you watched grow old and had a sad life, became a sad person and an easy joke. It's understandable that people get emotional and reminisce. And on some level it reminds us all about our inevitable mortality and how nothing stays the same.
Man, the news has been especially shitty lately.
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Pure pop bliss: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4auq5tlUX4
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Post your fave MJ song, I'll go 1st -
Give Into Me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqDOsKKhb88&fmt=18-
There are so many, it's a very difficult thing to answer but I suppose it has to be Man in the Mirror.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zpTQCQEFhg-
great choice - i'm also heavily partial to dirty diana for some reason
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Dirty Diana
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People always say this about MTV but I must ask - if MTV went back to being a 24x7 video channel (as opposed to what it is now, a 24x7 reality show channel), would you even watch it? Would anyone?
Today we have Youtube which gives us any video in the world any time we want. Today people wouldn't watch MTV if it showed music videos. MTV as a music video channel had a window of relevance and now that's gone.
I liked MTV back in the day and it would be cool if it had never changed its mission, but it did and it makes sense that it did. I say let it go. -
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lol
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I remember being a kid and my mom was clothes shopping in the mall at like JC Penney's or Dillards or something and they had a giant enlarged photo on the wall of the Thriller record. Like, not the cover art but you know that circular label in the middle of a vinyl record? A closeup of that. Thriller was THAT influential that the mere record was considered art when it was out.
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When my brother and I were younger, we had Thriller on vinyl that we had to share between the two of us. One night we started to fight over the album and my mother stepped in, took the record and snapped it over her knee and handed us each a half and sent us to our rooms. :(
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CAPTAIN EO hells yes hahaha
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and sexier
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what a long, strange trip it's been. :(
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