Like to hear your opinions on immersion Vs Gameyness. Which do you think is most important, which do you prefer (think I already know what Jeff will say!) and are they largely mutually exclusive?

Ive tried out alot of games off the back of podcast recommendations. They are normally games I don't naturally gravitate towards, but if they get a lot of praise I give them a try. Titles like Bayonetta and Vanquish for example. I end up playing them for a couple of hours and then often just give up. I now realise that games that require me to learn patterns, become adept with restrictive systems, be extremely dexterous etc are not for me. Its just too frustrating unless I knock down the difficulty. Gamey games bascially. Demon souls is the poster boy of this, I guess.
On the other hand, with modern graphical capabilities, developers can provide us with incredibly interesting and compelling worlds, Skyrim is an obvious example, which provide a different sort of challenge but is more leaning towards immersing the player in the world rather than removing immersion through frustrating repetition, pattern recognition and shooting the glowey bit.

This gameyness obviously goes back to the roots of video gaming and a lot of people would say its the most important thing about this medium. Ive never been attracted to it myself though.......