Weekend Confirmed 81 - Rage, Dark Souls, television on Xbox 360

Why is Garnett wearing a woman's blouse in the behind the scenes episode 81? With his comb over and blouse, all he needs is lipstick to make his outfit complete. LOL!!

Modern gamers are soft.


Including myself, I have been softened up so much by modern games. And I might even enjoy it.

Once, not too long ago, games had genuine consequences. Real no-foolin consequences. If you died, you lost a life, if you lost enough lives the game ended, reset, finished. This resulted in genuine tension, genuine no-fooling tension, you'd literally be on the edge of your seat, sometimes sweating over just surviving or making it passed that difficult leap.

Now games treat us like toddlers. They fill the screen with hints, tips, tutorials and solutions to the puzzles and obstacles we face. We have an unlimited store of lives. We can try something as many times as we want without fear of any consequenses. If we die, no worry, we can just restart from a point shorty before. When we face a choice in an RPG there's no wrong choice, just an alternate reward depending on which path we take (which can be easily googled or we can save and restart).

The modern gamer wouldn't know what failure is, it'd probably give them a heart attack. We expect to play through every game beginning to end and watch the ending without ANY chance of failing. If we get stuck on a difficult section we blame the developer.

The modern video game is like a theme park ride. It creates a pleasant illusion of danger, the animatronic creature looms in front of us but we know it'll give way and let us pass. The theme park employee shouts and acts like it's real danger but it's all in good fun. There's never any real risk. Basically, when you play a modern video game you're never really in any real danger or at risk of failure, just the exciting illlusion that things are really exciting and dangerous.

But I have to admit, as a married man with kids, when I get home from work at night do I really want to fail at a video game?

Maybe, maybe not. I really do miss the genuine tension and fear of failing that only older games offered and the sense of actual challenge this created.

I'm torn.

I'm really interested in seeing what Cannata's impression on Dark Souls will be next week. Most people who have played Demon's Souls know that he is currently in the 'WTF why is this game so mean' phase. By the time the player starts figuring out some of the systems and beats their fist boss is when they start to warm up to the game.

Jeff, you really liked American Horror Story? REALLY?

Good god man.

Hey Garnett, You know I'm looking to your input on Forza 4 and the GT5 2.0 patch.

Insidesimracing.tv did an in-depth preview of Forza 4 and pointed out some interesting details when using a wheel.

Also, seeing how you were not a fan of the ala carte GT-HD model, what will be your take on Forza 4's car pack dlc?

One discussion I was missing from the (as usual excellent) show was about idTech 5. What does the release of Rage mean for the future of idTech?

I have also noted that a lot of reviewers of Rage has commented on Rage as a hodge-podge of excellent ideas, not all fully fleshed out. Could that perhaps be on purpose? Just to show off the possibilities with the new engine?

Garnett, the Zune Pass did drop from $14.99 to $9.99 but it no longer includes the 10 free songs. It was a better deal before where essentailly you where paying for 10 songs, a dollar each, and 5 dollars for the service. But the problem was that many people would forget to use their free song credits. If you don't use them you lose them. The credits don't role over. That said, now it's at the same price point as Spodify and Rhapsody and $10 a month is a bit easier to swallow than $15. I currently use Zune Pass on and off (you can start and stop it whenever you want) and I have to say that I do enjoy it. Their Smart DJ feature is an awesome way to discover new songs and artist similar to the artist that you select. I do have a Windows Phone 7 and I love using the Zune Pass in the car. And it also works on the Xbox 360. Oh, and now the Zune Pass does also let you stream (most) music videos on your PC but I don't think it works on the Xbox 360.

By the way, if you still want to get into Demon's Souls' NOW'S THE TIME.

For the ga,e's 2nd anniversary, the US servers are on permanent white world tendency until the 17th. This means that in general, enemies will be weaker and certain events will already be unlocked. On the 17th the game will switch th black tendency which will unlock it's own events and make enemies harder, but drop rates will also go up.

I have cut the cable...

I am currently a subscriber of Atlantic Broadband (a small ISP). Three months ago we got rid of our Cable (HD, DVR, multi-room... the whole package). My bill was +$230 a month, so I got rid of all our services except the 15/Mb connection ($55/mo). My wife and I are loving it..

Between gaming (swtor, Xbox, Netflix and hulu+) we save a whole bunch of money; which is nice since we have a baby on the way. Its fun adding shows we are going to want to watch with our baby to the instant queue. I like where TV 2.0 is going.

Interestingly I just bought their newer "Unleashed" service (40Mb/s) because it wasn't much higher. I can tell they are changing their business model to suit the new culture of entertainment.

My deepest condolences to those of you who have to deal with caps :(

Demon’s Souls really shined when it came to co-op. If you were summoned into other games, you wouldn’t lose your souls/points when you died, so it was a great way to explore new areas. If you actually beat the boss while summoned into another player’s game, you were revived such that you could summon other players into your game. Combining these strategies allowed me to plow through some sections of the game faster than you might think. Since I played the Chinese/Korean version, I also got these great thank-you notes from other players, so it was a really unique multiplayer experience for me.

I haven’t yet been able to try Dark Souls’ co-op options, but I’m hoping they are similar. Hopefully you all check those out since it really affects your experience with the game; the game is much harder if you never help anyone else.

I will say that there are times when Dark Souls could be slightly more instructive. Demon’s Souls funneled you along more, particularly at the beginning. Subsequently it was easier to tell which of the hub-worlds you weren’t ready for.

Still, I’m surprised to hear complaints about encountering areas where there are high-level enemies. I usually hear the opposite complaint, which is that areas are locked off – or that enemies scale their level to match yours, mitigating the impact of leveling-up your character.

One of the reasons I’m most excited about Dark Souls is having this incredible world to explore – I find myself reminded of the original Zelda, which didn’t coddle you either. Sure, sometimes I like to be able to sit back and enjoy that perfect balance of auto-aim and health regeneration where I feel like I’m better at a game than I really am, or can immerse myself in a game without worrying about mistakes; Dark Souls isn’t that game. It doesn’t pull punches, but you can make it easier by leveling-up and using co-op, so I actually see it as less difficult than games like Mega Man. Incidentally, that’s my own example of a hardcore series I can’t get into, even though I love the look and feel. I can understand if Dark/Demon’s Souls ends up being that series for you, but I hope you give it a shot.

Regarding the conversation on Dark Souls, two things surprised me:

1) Everyone on the podcast treated Dark Souls like it was the first game in history to use difficulty and challenge as a way to funnel players down the appropriate path. True, there are many games that rely on locked doors and other similar methods to block off more advanced areas of the game until the gamer is 'ready,' but is it really all that uncommon for a game to allow you the freedom to figure it out for yourself? Just off the top of my head, Bethesda games are a perfect example. In both Fallout 3 and Oblivion, you could find areas in the beginning of the game that would hand your ass to you on a silver platter, no questions asked. This should trigger the obvious response: "Huh, maybe I shouldn't go that way right now." This is nothing new.

As for Jeff's commentary about enjoying the risk but not finding the reward, I hope that he's played the game a bit more now and found a good rhythm. He seemed pretty down on the idea of losing all of his souls in the Catacombs, but I was having a hard time figuring out why this was such an issue for him. He had already leveled up using his souls from the Asylum, so how many souls did he actually have on the line? A couple hundred? Also, by his own admission, he sprinted past mobs of enemies he couldn't kill with (apparently) a stockpile of souls he wasn't willing to lose. The idea of doing something like this should really raise some alarm bells in your head in a game like this.

2) There was no discussion at all about the multiplayer aspects of the game. Sure, they commented upon the ability to leave messages for other players, but one part of the game that really, truly shines is the sense of community and comaraderie that it creates. Pushing through an incredibly difficult section, though enjoyable, can be a lonesome and stressful experience. Catching a glimpse of another player's phantom as he/she runs up a nearby staircase or battles his/her own invisible demons is like an oasis in the desert--unexpected, and it helps to propel you forward on your own journey. Or, dying in your attempt, seeing the ghosts of other players huddled around the bonfire as you respawn... you know you're not alone--this section is handing out grief to a host of fellow gamers.

Even little environmental cues like the ringing of the bell at the top of the chapel... I struggled for hours on end to reach a point where I could ring the bell myself, but it gave me reassurance to hear that bell ringing in the distance as I died repeatedly. Other gamers were doing it, so I could, too. When I finally managed to ring the bell, I had to smile and wonder if other gamers were sitting in the dark somewhere, dying in game, but listening to the sound of the bell and deciding to give it one more try.

And that doesn't even touch upon the feeling of fellowship and goodwill that can be had by actually inviting other players into your game. Tackling a challenging boss together that has given you a lot of trouble? Really, really satisfying. I don't wax ecstatic about many games, but Dark Souls is really something special and I hope the WC Crew gives it the fullest chance they can.

Poor, poor, jeff but remember it's only week 4 and 2-2 is not that different than 1-3 now 0-4!!!

Anyway, WR A. Brown of Pittsburg maybe, also T. Young of Detroit both seem to be #2 guys. Someone's probably got him but Nate Washington of Tennessee. Also trade johnson for a high second tier if you can remind the taker that Johnson has his buy week during that injury time so your really only losing 2 weeks.

Good luck:) PS Garnett what your team problem, and don't forget Rivers start out seasons really slow in general.

Omg big surprise Mario 3D land is awesome. I know who knew that a Mario game was gonna actually be good!!! Yeah that was a big fat easy bet.

And omg who thought Mario kart 7 was gonna be great... Actually I was with Xav and alot concerned about the boat mode and flight mode. After those last preview videos my fears where set to rest. Mario dropped through the ice an I was like Noooo! Oh yeah propeller mode that freaking awesome.

I guess the 3DS is gonna be just fine after all... I mean was there any doubt. Oh yeah infinity blade might make us all just wanna swipe our lives away lol;)

Garnett: regarding Dark Souls

I think the idea you were trying to get across is that progress is measured in the player's gained knowledge as much as it is in how far you can get.

Still haven't played it, but that idea definitely mirrors my experience with roguelikes, where you will likely spend a considerable amount of time getting killed and starting over, but every time you play, you learn a little more and understand the game world a little better, which is what ultimately enables you to reach the next goal.

Dark Souls:

So I know I might be a pansy when it comes to challenging games now, but when I play a game I like a challenge to a certain extent. I dont have time to play games to torture me. Truth is I dont really play RPG's so maybe I shouldn't even be part of this conversation at all, but I understand there are games made for a specific crowd and Dark souls sounds like a game made for people who like to challenge themselves to an extent that doesnt make sense to me. Hell I use to trophy whore games and when I played "Uncharted 2" on hard I ended up not enjoying the game as much. Because of this I have started playing games on normal so I can enjoy the experience more and if I am so tempted I will play it again on hard. My goal when playing games now is not necessarily trophy hunting and is more to experience the game and enjoy the story, and less punish myself.

I forgot why I came to post. This game sounds a little broken, because I dont see why they cant leave some hints on what to do. The concept that because you are being destroyed you should know not to go that way is broken. That is just my opinion. It is not for me.

Xbox TV thingy:

I really enjoy concept of this, the cool thing is that you can have all of your entertainment in one location. The problem is that you need to previously have all of these services to use them. For me I am a person that cut the cord to cable a while ago. Too much stuff that I dont actually watch and too much time wasted watching stupid stuff. So all of these cool services are useless to me. When HBOGO becomes usable without needing cable I will be on board.

I absolutely hate platformers because you can die over and over again and never progress.

With the Demons/Dark Souls games, if you can't progress, it's because you're not learning and it's your own fault.

I'm guessing Jeff hasn't played a lot of JRPGs because, normally, if something is kicking your ass, you don't go back and fight it over and over again (or "conquer" it as he said). You go away, level up and THEN come back and fight it.

I mean think about when you get the airships in Final Fantasy games. There are always islands which have super powerful monsters on them that you can fight, but you quickly learn it's not worth trying to fight those monsters when you're underlevelled. Same kind of thing.

Jeff's comment about androgyny being one of the "quirks" of JRPGs and Garnett's comment about zippers came across as cheap.

And I will reiterate. If you want a game that addresses all the thing you complain about with JRPGs, import Xenoblade.

Based on everything I've heard from friends and people in the media that I trust, I'm pretty confident that I would have more fun hammering rusted railroad spikes through my scrotum than I would playing Dark Souls.

"Hardcore" versus "Intuitiveness"

Just to pick up on Garnett's point about Dark Souls, I think it is a pretty big misnomer to call Dark Souls "hardcore" in the way we usually use that term or even "hard." The word hardcore is usually reserved for someone that basically makes a lifestyle out of playing a certain game like "hardcore" Street Fighter or Quake players. A hardcore Devil May Cry player is one that continuously plays thorough and triple S ranks every game.


I would argue that Demon souls is not a "hardcore" game in the same way that fans of a particular genre or series need only apply. By the aforementioned definition, I have never in my life been a hardcore player of anything. I like Street Fighter, but I suck at it. I'm not very good at Halo or Call of Duty. I almost always come in near the bottom when I play online matches. When I went back to finish Gears of War 2 before 3 came out, I bumped it down to "easy." I don't platinum rank games or play bullet hell shooters. I'm not masochistic and I'm barely competitive at all when it comes to videogames. I came into Dark Souls totally blind having never even played Demon Souls. And I did so hesitantly because I don't typically like hard or frustrating games.

And yet, after 10 hours, I absolutely adore Dark Souls. Let me try to briefly explain why.

What Dark Souls has made me realize is how passive I play most games. Recovery mechanics in modern shooters mean that we barely have to worry about being shot as long as we retreat for 10 seconds behind something. Most modern Action games and JRPGs have become so passive that most of game time is spend mashing on attack buttons and only boss encounters demand much more.

I've learned to compensate for this lack of real engagement. I listen to podcasts, I chat with friends, I drink lots of beer while I play. I admire the eye candy of explosions and vistas around me and pay more attention to that stuff than I do the enemies I'm fighting most of the time. But Dark Souls made me realize how great a gaming experience can be when I don't have resort to those distractions. When the gameplay can be good enough to hold my attention fully on a moment by moment basis. There is no more immersive experience than that. The prettiest mega-textures in the world won't get you there.

Dark Souls isn't overly hard, or non-intuitive, or obscure. It simply demands your attention. It is such a conscious choice that the designers go out of their way to refuse players the ability to use voice chat while they play. You can't button mash in Dark Souls, not even on the easiest enemies. And it's not because they are hard, it is because the game is interesting enough that even the weak enemies are going to try to engage you--they will block and flank and try to gang up on you. They will wait until you attack and try to counter. It isn't that they are "hard" in the traditional way we think of games being hard. You don't have to have lightening reflexes, you just simply have to pay attention to them and your surroundings.

The same could be said for figuring out where to go, what weapons to use, what to upgrade. There is no right way to do this stuff (unless you ARE one of those crazy hardcore players trying to make a perfect build). There is only the way that works for you. Everything else is just for the New Game Plus crowd.

Every really good game has moments where you are on the edge of your seat or when you feel a sense of real accomplishment. But in Dark Souls those moments come minute by minute. if I have a real criticism of Dark Souls it is almost that it is to exciting, too exhilirating. Sometimes I have to take a break because it is too intense too often. I have had harrowing encounters with basic enemies. I have never been more scared my life than I have been playing this game and having a giant black knight chase me down a stair well. I never felt so much was at stake before in whether or not I land a blow or manage to down a potion in time. There are big moments in Dark Souls and they happen all the damn time.

So maybe it isn't for everyone, but Dark Souls isn't a "hardcore" game in the way we typically use that term. You don't have to spend years honing your skills in tournaments or learn some secret slang language or gain muscle memory by practicing combos to enjoy it. You don't have to be a member of a clan or drink a pile of energy drinks or be 18 with the reflexes of a god to find it engaging. You simply have to learn not play games as passively as you have been conditioned to play them. And you'll probably end up wishing more games were good enough that you didn't have to resort to distractions to tune out all the repetition.

At the moment Australia already has the local cable company Foxtel on the console for about half of the cost of cable subscription.
http://www.foxtel.com.au/xbox/packages/default.htm
I just cant wait for Fibre to the Home to reach my house in Keith South Australia which is 250 Km from the nearest major city then I can also have 100Mbps internet.
http://www.nbnco.com.au/

Isn't what Jeff wants is what Nintendo is doing with the 3DS with Spotpass. I know they have Spotpass exclusive content that you can only get at Best Buy.

I hope when you come back to Dark Souls you will talk about the online features and the different covenants and their goals in the game. I've said it before and I'll say it again, "If you don't understand the online aspect of Dark Souls you are missing half of what this game it and what elevates it from being just a tightly design dungeon crawler to something really innovative and special."

It amazes me how well the human eye can pick up on even the most subtle pattern recognition.

The megatexture tech in Rage makes such an intangible difference that is so easy to notice, but so hard to describe.

Every area, every inch of the scenery feels like it was placed there with purpose by an artist. Nothing procedural, nothing repeated, it looks organic, believable... real.

From both a looks and gameplay perspective, Rage has surpassed Crysis 2 as my favorite single-player shooter of the year (thus far).

On the subject of comparing RPGs, one weird anecdotal thing I've noticed is that I've enjoyed all my favorite RPGs for completely different reasons. It just goes to show how RPGs are probably the most flexible genre in gaming in terms of what defines them.

Now before you get into the semantic "any game is a role-playing game" argument, forget the actual word "Role-Playing Game" and focus on the elements that have come to define the word. This is just me talking, but I've come to identify three or four over the years (depending on how you split it up):

1)Combat/Stat Management/Dice Rolls

2)Nonlinear Exploration

3)Storyline

4)Characters (I choose to count this separate because there are RPGs where I've hated the story but still enjoyed the characters)

Right now I'm loving Dark Souls for its core combat and equipment-based gameplay, and that's almost all the reason I need. On the flipside, I know people hated Dragon Age II and to an extent the Mass Effect games because of dumbed-down gameplay, but I still really enjoyed their characters and parts of their stories enough to really enjoy those games overall.

If I do get into Skyrim, it'll probably be for great exploration above all else. Conversely, The Witcher 2 had completely unbalanced combat when it first launched, and it is quite linear compared to most RPGs, but the main thing that sold the game was how well CDProjekt portrayed the narrative and atmosphere of Andreji Sapkowski's world.

Maybe I'm just weird like that when it comes to RPGs. Maybe a lot of people should step back and ask themselves why they even like each of these games.

RE: xbox TV discussion.

Garnet, I assume you pay for your internet connection? If you do, then you are paying for the bits and bytes, and infrastructure it takes to provide that internet connection. If they can't afford to offer you what they are selling because of over subscription, that is up to them to solve.

I do not want my ISP looking for a cut on watching ESPN over the Internet, much like I don't want my ISP looking for a cut on my online banking transactions.

Your power company does not get a cut of profits based on how you use the electricity they provide, your telephone company does not get a cut of profits based on what you use your phone for. Your ISP should not get a profit based on what you use your bandwidth for.

I didn't really understand where Jeff was coming from when talking about Rage as an RPG. I haven't played it yet but everything I've heard is that its basically a hub where you drive to shooter missions. Sure there's mini games and side stuff in it but nothing that makes it stand out as an RPG. Nothing wrong with that, I mean the game doesn't have to have RPG stuff to be fun/good I just don't couldn't understand what Jeff was saying was RPG-like other than some crafting.
Anyone who's played it want to explain more on the RPG/non-RPG side of Rage?

Just a funny thought when jeff and Garnett where talking about all the dragons being in Skyrim. There are non left over for war of the north Garnett said, I chuckled. It's funny because in Tolkien fiction Smaug was the last dragon... So there are literally no dragons in war of the north:)

The internet kiddies' reaction to Dark Souls is why 99% of games are tired, well-tread experiences that have been focused grouped all to hell.

Random question.

As we use more bandwidth with services like netflix, the cost of internet rises. Many providers already enforce a bandwidth cap and tack on an extra charge for each gig used over that cap. If costs continue to rise (both for internet providers and customers) and fewer companies offer unlimited usage plans, how would that affect online gaming? Could this trend prevent content from being 100% digitally distributed and keep brick & mortar stores open longer than many are anticipating?

Last comment on Skyrim I swear, notice how everyone refers to elder Scrolls 4 simply as oblivion. Notice jeff does this in the episode. So yeah maybe the enthusiast knows but how does a general person know that Skyrim is the follow up to Oblivion. Just bad brand awareness if you ask me, but your not so I'm done.

Billy's message to game developers "HOW DARE you make a game outside of my comfort zone!!! if your game doesn't have instant gratification it FAILS"

I'm now thinking about signing up for HBOGO so I can stream more episodes of The Wire.I don't really watch to much cable TV anymore myself video streaming from netflix and other services can fill my fix.

Somehow the discussion of Skyward Sword made me more interested in it than before despite the complaints about standing up. Nintendo should make Mario Kart 7 spin-offs like a shooter starring dry bones or a prequel starring Jumpman on a lawnmower and they can even make a CG movie with product placement.

I like how Jeff believes that all games should be judged equally (cough Angry Birds GotY), but couches his defense of Infinity Blade in the fact that "its not Oblivion."

The whole Dark Souls discussion should be listened to by everyone on the internet that participates in the Dark Souls v. Skyrim argument. They're so utterly different.

It was very sad Steve jobs it reminds us that no matter how much success we achieve in life, never to take your health for granted. Truly a remarkable man.

Continue on your work outs Xav it's the best decission you'll ever make.