Sony granted subpoena for GeoHot visitors

A federal magistrate has granted Sony the ability to issue subpoenas, in a move the company hopes will reveal the identities of PlayStation 3...

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A federal magistrate has granted Sony the ability to issue subpoenas, in a move the company hopes will reveal the identities of PlayStation 3 hackers. Wired reports that the decision granted by Magistrate Joseph Spero will allow Sony to subpoena the web provider of PS3 hacker George Hotz, as well as sites like YouTube and Google.

The subpoena will require the web provider, Bluehost, to give "all server logs, IP address logs, account information, account access records and application or registration forms" on Hotz's site. It can also be used more broadly to obtain "any other identifying information corresponding to persons or computers who have accessed or downloaded files" connected to the hacks.

Sony argued it needed the information to prove that Hotz had distributed the hack, and to settle jurisdictional confusion that has already resulted in a delay of the case. If Sony can prove that Hotz distributed the hack to California residents, it can sue Hotz as planned in San Francisco.

On the other hand, the subpoena is raising privacy concerns. Corynne McSherry, an attorney with the Electronic Frontier Foundation, sent a letter to Magistrate Spero calling the subpoenas "overly broad" and "inappropriate."

Besides Bluehost, Sony will be able to obtain information from YouTube regarding the IP addresses of those who watched a demonstration video, and Twitter for Hotz's tweets.

Sony is aggressively going after the hackers, threatening to sue anyone who distributed the software key. The company recently issued an ultimatum for hackers, which resulted soon after in bans from the PlayStation Network.

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From The Chatty
  • reply
    March 7, 2011 10:30 AM

    Comment on Sony granted subpoena for GeoHot visitors, by Steve Watts.

    • reply
      March 7, 2011 10:37 AM

      Summary: A magistrate has granted Sony those subpoenas it was looking for, for BlueHost, Google, Yahoo, and Twitter. They hope to track down everyone who looked up the hacking info, but some feel it goes too far.

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 10:42 AM

        [deleted]

        • reply
          March 7, 2011 10:46 AM

          It really doesnt matter what justification they use, the amount of data and the type of data they are requesting is unreasonable...you don't know what they are going to do with it.

          • reply
            March 7, 2011 10:51 AM

            [deleted]

          • reply
            March 7, 2011 1:15 PM

            Also, the court can rule that the information gathered with a specific subpoena be used only for a certain task. If the information is used elsewhere, it can be thrown out. Not saying that's what happening here, since I don't know. Just saying it's possible.

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          March 7, 2011 3:11 PM

          That's a fair criticism, maybe I should have been clearer. The main issue is the proof of distribution and the jurisdictional issue. On the other hand, Sony has threatened to sue anyone distributing the hack, so having IP info on those who viewed it might lead them to more people who helped disseminate it.

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      March 7, 2011 10:39 AM

      And what do they plan to do with that information is the question? I doubt any large corporations ability to treat such information with proper process.

    • reply
      March 7, 2011 10:40 AM

      I looked at his site, so fucking what

    • reply
      March 7, 2011 10:45 AM

      is this SporkyReeve dude the new First Post troll?

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 10:56 AM

        That would be Steve Watts... the guy who wrote this post.

        • reply
          March 7, 2011 10:58 AM

          Nitrium, update your script!

        • reply
          March 7, 2011 11:00 AM

          Lol, why doesn't Steve have an awesome new Steve Watts user name

          • reply
            March 7, 2011 11:39 AM

            They changed their pre-order plans for full user names and they are all sold out. However, he got a free $10 DLC! so he should be happy.

          • reply
            March 7, 2011 1:50 PM

            lol wats

          • reply
            March 7, 2011 3:12 PM

            They were giving out awesome usernames and I missed out?

        • reply
          March 7, 2011 11:01 AM

          oh ok. I noticed pigvomit disagreed and I thought maybe it's just another user.

    • reply
      March 7, 2011 10:46 AM

      While Geohot's lawyer agreed to this as far I can see, I'm fairly surprised it was granted regardless due to the sheer breadth of what they were asking for. It seems so tangental to the case, unlikely to prove anything relevant (some of the viewers will undoubtedly be in California, but that's hardly substantial evidence that the case should be tried there).

      If I want visitor info for some site, can I now collude with someone and file a lawsuit and subpoena it and just expect that third parties will play along?

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 1:12 PM

        "some of the viewers will undoubtedly be in California, but that's hardly substantial evidence that the case should be tried there"

        Isn't that precisely the evidence that proves the case could be tried there?

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        March 7, 2011 1:14 PM

        "substantial evidence" is not a standard that determines jurisdiction. it's about showing that he had minimum contacts in California.

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zippo_Manufacturing_Co._v._Zippo_Dot_Com,_Inc.

        • reply
          March 7, 2011 1:22 PM

          "A passive website that does little more than make information available to those who are interested init is not grounds for the exercise of personal jurisdiction."

          Doesn't that seem like it would apply? He wasn't operating a business; the most you might claim would be comments sections.

          • reply
            March 7, 2011 1:25 PM

            That's for a 1L to decide during a Civ Pro exam.

            In reality, this is not a determination that will be made by a magistrate judge prior to granting a warrant, it's something to be discussed during the course of the proceedings.

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              March 7, 2011 1:27 PM

              I'm not a lawyer and never claimed to be, so I'm fully aware I can be talking out my ass. It just seems like the biggest of stretches to include Youtube or Twitter in this specifically.

              • reply
                March 7, 2011 1:30 PM

                If there are comments and he responds to them, or he even has some sort of a contact form on the website, then yeah, it could very well be interactive. Can't imagine what would be more interactive anyway, outside of a webstore.

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                  March 7, 2011 1:37 PM

                  Is noncommercial interaction through a third party website the same thing? That seems considerably different than what the Zippo case was determining.

                  • reply
                    March 7, 2011 1:38 PM

                    And note, I was always specifically referring to the third party sites, hence the comments about visitor info in my original post.

                  • reply
                    March 7, 2011 1:42 PM

                    No clue. This is all stuff that they'll figure out during the proceedings; my point is that you don't need that much for the warrant since these are not things that are to be determined by a magistrate.

    • reply
      March 7, 2011 11:02 AM

      Why did you grant them that, Steve Watts?

    • reply
      March 7, 2011 1:04 PM

      I'LL SUE YOU!!! I'LL SUE ALL OF YOU!!!

    • reply
      March 7, 2011 1:08 PM

      Ahhh I don't understand the logic in going after one man, regardless whether or not he's responsible for current events; it's fruitless. Sony for whatever reason I guess thinks this is like cutting the head from the beast.

    • reply
      March 7, 2011 2:23 PM

      I for one applaud Sony for doing this.. GeoFail has the ego the size of Texas, plastering his face all over the place instead of doing all his work underground. You think you'll just be able to do whatever you want? I really don't think this kids that smart and I really hope he gets what's coming too him. Make an example of this kid is what I say... And if anyone is freaking out about the IP stuff it's just for use in court to show he distributed the files. This whole PS3 JailBreak will be short lived and I'm glad at least one company is doing something about it.

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 2:25 PM

        Yes, when it comes to things I've bought, I do think I should be able to do what I want.

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 2:25 PM

        holy fucking lol.

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 2:55 PM

        How many companies were supposed to do something about the PS3 Jailbreak?

        • reply
          March 7, 2011 2:58 PM

          All of them. All the companies.

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 3:13 PM

        Yes the PS3 will be short lived from now until when the PS4 comes out.

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 3:38 PM

        so having an ego means he deserves this? ok...

        • reply
          March 7, 2011 3:54 PM

          [deleted]

          • Ebu legacy 10 years legacy 20 years
            reply
            March 7, 2011 4:04 PM



            The *real* Steve Jobs has actually been incarcerated for many years...but Apple couldn't survive without its mascot. Enter...

            iJobs

        • reply
          March 7, 2011 4:28 PM

          he kinda does, but not because of an ego

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 3:54 PM

        oh i get it geofail

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 3:55 PM

        [deleted]

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 4:04 PM

        [deleted]

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 4:09 PM

        I think some of you have it twisted. Other hackers are hiding on the forums going "I did that, Geohot copied my work." but you don't see them stepping up to the plate saying "I DID THAT SUE ME".

        It's more balls than ego if anything. He did the work and hes fucking standing up for it. Everyone else is cowering in the corner and whining like some little bitches that they aren't getting their two minutes of fame.

        I for one like to do whatever the fuck I want with things I purchase.

        If you read the court documents Sony just doesn't give a fuck about the consumer. Their excuse for turning off OtherOS was "We didn't know the consumer excepted this feature to be available longer than 1 year." (limited warranty time) That right there is a big FUCK YOU to everyone that bought a PS3.

        With that reasoning Sony can turn any fucking thing on the PS3 on or off whenever they want.
        Yeah i'm totally down with that HUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRR DUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRR

        tldr: make like a tree and get the fuck outta here.

      • reply
        March 7, 2011 4:45 PM

        lol god i hope this is a troll

      • reply
        March 8, 2011 7:51 AM

        This case goes beyond would be piracy or even Jealousy for Geohot; as you made clear you have for him. Even if you don't like him, this case has everything to do with you and your rights as a consumer. The problem with your thinking is that it is narrow minded. You are not seeing the big picture or the new foundation that will be laid for companies like Sony to dictate how consumer must use their products. You clearly do not understand how laws works or how far a company will go to ensure profit and control.

    • reply
      March 7, 2011 8:32 PM

      I ' l l t y p e s l o w f o r t h e m o d e r a t o r s .... Geohot should NOT be sued by Sony for everyone stealling games. From what I have read, it was not his intention for people to burn copies of games. Like the site I posted early, it seems to be up and running. Unless Geohot has a completely different name and running a website on a different server. I guess they will have to prove that in the courts. On a side note, what's http://www.w3.org/ ? Privacy workshop? huh? lol

      • reply
        March 8, 2011 8:08 AM

        GeoHot's intent is irrelevant. He is providing information for circumventing access control which is in violation of the DMCA.

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          March 8, 2011 2:26 PM

          Its against Sony's online agreement which GeoHot says he never connected to, in turn, never agreed to. Not only that, he should nit be held liable for what others used the hack for. If you believe him, which he would say the same thing under oath, pirating games was not his idea of what people would use his work for. Kind of like the free games you can download on the iPhone, its not his fault that happened.

          • reply
            March 8, 2011 9:39 PM

            Sony isn't suing GeoHot because he broke the PSN terms of service. They're suing him because he disseminated information on circumventing measures that control access to copyrighted works, which is illegal under the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA). It doesn't matter what anyone is using the hack for, and no one is holding him liable for that.

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